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 Post subject: Re: The Playground randomness thread
PostPosted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 3:03 am 
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What MD said. Possibly ending a relationship with grandparents is very hard, but if something happened to Malka, that's the sort if thing you (and maybe she) would carry around forever. I wish I were there to offer you a big hug and a cuppa. I know that you said you were unsure about your husband laying down the law, but make sure he's there when you talk to your mom so that he can support you, keep you from backing down, remind you that you're *not* that 12 year old girl, and just hold your hand. He can help you make the hard decisions and then come home and cry and vent. Also, do your best to leave Malka somewhere else if you have a coming-to-Jesus (heh) meeting with you folks. This situation sucks asparagus, but you and the Mr. are doing great with Malka!


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 Post subject: Re: The Playground randomness thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 4:33 pm 
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I took Inez to a new dentist yesterday and she thinks her tooth weirdness is nursing caries plus some possible iron staining. I feel so shitty and guilty. She's always been a big time night nurser and I have definitely been lax about wiping her teeth (even though we're good about brushing). I mean, I'm nursing her to sleep - poking my finger in her mouth once she pops off seemed to kind of defeat the purpose. Ugh. Lesson learned, I guess. But I feel bad that her teeth are messed up and it's essentially all my fault.

eta: The dentist thinks there's only one cavity - it's not like her teeth are rotting out of her head. But still.


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 Post subject: Re: The Playground randomness thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 4:55 pm 
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I am sorry Pinko. That sounds so stressful, and honestly, it sounds like you did all you could. We do exactly what you describe (except we don't wipe her teeth) and L has staining too, so its one of our big fears. We are taking her to a dentist next month to see if we can head anything off, but I don't think there is much more one can do. They can't do the F treatment until they can spit at 3....

Maybe Kimba has better ideas....

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 Post subject: Re: The Playground randomness thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 4:59 pm 
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Oi, I thought the nursing caries thing was sort of a myth. We don't wipe Freya's teeth either. She doesn't nurse to sleep at night, but nurses right before and then we look at the stars on her ceiling/rock gently, etc. so yeah, cleaning her teeth would be a pain then.

Hm, what KellyMom has to say about dental health and breastfeeding: http://kellymom.com/health/baby-health/tooth-decay/


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 Post subject: Re: The Playground randomness thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 5:15 pm 
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Well, I think it's a myth in that the whole "breastfeeding will rot your child's teeth!" thing has been debunked. I think some kids get cavities and a lot don't, regardless of nursing. I don't think nursing "caused" this situation per se but we've done everything else by the book when it comes to keeping sugars off her teeth, so the night nursing seems like the most likely culprit. And the pattern fits with what "nursing caries" look like - top four front teeth by the gumline.

She had a fluoride treatment yesterday and she has to go back for monthly ones for three months, then they'll reevaluate. (She spits very reliably, never heard the 3 thing before.)


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 Post subject: Re: The Playground randomness thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 6:03 pm 
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Tofulish wrote:
They can't do the F treatment until they can spit at 3....

Maybe Kimba has better ideas....


I don't have a lot of time to respond right now, but I just wanted to say, they can do a fluoride before age 3. It is called fluoride varnish. They paint it on the teeth.


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 Post subject: Re: The Playground randomness thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 6:28 pm 
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My dentist said they couldn't put it on until a kiddo can spit the remainder out. And he said that was 3. L can't reliably spit on demand yet. When is the youngest you can do the varnish?

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 Post subject: Re: The Playground randomness thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 9:19 pm 
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With varnish, there is no remainder to spit out. I would put fluoride varnish on any high risk baby or toddler with teeth, regardless of age. There is even a push to have physicians do it at well child visits. If they aren't getting it before age three it does not have the chance to prevent early childhood caries. Studies show it is very safe. This is not the same type of fluoride that most patients are familiar with. It is painted on the teeth.


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 Post subject: Re: The Playground randomness thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 9:23 pm 
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Thanks for your input kimba! What do you use to determine high risk? We both have terrible teeth and L is definitely getting staining.

Should I go to a pediatric dentist or can any dentist do it?

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 Post subject: Re: The Playground randomness thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 10:09 pm 
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Any dentist can do it, but that doesn't mean any dentist will do it. The recommendations are to see a dentist by age one but many dentists are uncomfortable with babies/toddlers because they don't usually train how to care for them in dental school. If parents had bad teeth, I would considerthat high risk.


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 Post subject: Re: The Playground randomness thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 11:56 pm 
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Kimba, this is so helpful. I am definitely looking into that varnish. I have great teeth, but my husband has terrible teeth, but the real problem is that we are ot good at brushing! I've finally resorted to holding her down, but still don't trust that I am doing a good job.


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 Post subject: Re: The Playground randomness thread
PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 4:45 pm 
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Thanks for that info. I just assumed that there wasn't much we could do yet. I've been needing to go for a checkup for a few weeks (eek!), so I'm going to take Freya and long and introduce her to the dentist. She is the most amazingly kind lady, so hoping that we might even sit in the chair or something. Can I ask, about the varnish, how often it needs to be done? Also, should I wait until she has more teeth (at 7 and holding now)?

Everyone in my family has pretty rotten teeth. K's aren't as straight as he likes, but they are in good condition otherwise. Hopefully those Norwegian genes will kick in. :)


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 Post subject: Re: The Playground randomness thread
PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 6:08 pm 
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Most recommendations are for every 3-4 months for high risk children under 3. I don't think you need to wait until she has more teeth. In fact, the recommendations really are to see a dentist by age 1 OR by the time the first tooth erupts, which ever comes first. Personally, I think screening, education and fluoride varnish can be done by physicians at well child visits BUT not all physicians have the proper training for this. It is getting better though. There is the Smiles for Life program which is a training program for physicians that covers info about fluoride varnish (and other oral health info) and I think most new primary care docs coming out of residency have completed the program.


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 Post subject: Re: The Playground randomness thread
PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 6:52 pm 
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Thanks for the info. We are noticing some staining on L's molar as well as the front teeth, and even her ped remarked on it. It sucks because we are brushing her teeth every night and I can't think of what we could do better. A friend's ped told them to just use baking soda on the stained teeth, but I don't know about that.

Any added suggestions for keeping their teeth clean?

And thank you SO much for your input Kimba!!!!

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 Post subject: Re: The Playground randomness thread
PostPosted: Fri Mar 01, 2013 7:15 am 
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Silas had early cavities that 2 dentists said were caused by night nursing, but they are the exact same teeth I had issues with as a child so I lean towards genetics as a huge factor. I wish we had known about the varnish. Silas had oral surgery under general at age 2 1/2. It was so sad.

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 Post subject: Re: The Playground randomness thread
PostPosted: Fri Mar 01, 2013 7:45 am 
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So I was telling my sister about this tooth cleaning thread ( my own baby has zero teeth at 7.5 months!) and she said her dentist told her that children's toothpaste was really just a yummy tasting paste that made toothbrushing more pleasant for kids and that it was just as good to brush the teeth with water until they were old enough to spit. Anybody else hear that? I mean I thought toothpaste - even the kiddie kind - had ingredients to...well I guess I don't know how toothpaste works. I think basically what this dentist said was that toothpaste is primarily a carrier for fluoride, so if your toothpaste doesn't have fluoride it is really kind of useless. That doesn't seem right to me.


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 Post subject: Re: The Playground randomness thread
PostPosted: Fri Mar 01, 2013 10:26 am 
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annasrobbie wrote:
So I was telling my sister about this tooth cleaning thread ( my own baby has zero teeth at 7.5 months!) and she said her dentist told her that children's toothpaste was really just a yummy tasting paste that made toothbrushing more pleasant for kids and that it was just as good to brush the teeth with water until they were old enough to spit. Anybody else hear that? I mean I thought toothpaste - even the kiddie kind - had ingredients to...well I guess I don't know how toothpaste works. I think basically what this dentist said was that toothpaste is primarily a carrier for fluoride, so if your toothpaste doesn't have fluoride it is really kind of useless. That doesn't seem right to me.

Our pediatric dentist said to used fluoridated toothpaste, but only a tiny smear. We do that usually twice a day with Zeph (~8 months). He happens to love it - not sure how that happened, because his brother HATED it when he was that age. Lucky, I guess.

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 Post subject: Re: The Playground randomness thread
PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 9:22 am 
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They busted a childporn ring in our area, and I am kind of shocked at how many people were involved and how many of those people had regular access to children, including as babysitters etc.

Ariann, I hope things are going well for you. Sending lots of good thoughts.

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 Post subject: Re: The Playground randomness thread
PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 10:16 am 
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Tofulish wrote:
They busted a childporn ring in our area, and I am kind of shocked at how many people were involved and how many of those people had regular access to children, including as babysitters etc.


Yuck. I hope all the kids in those men's care are OK.

This is exactly the sort of story that pits my theoretical feminism not wanting to categorically discriminate against men as caretakers with my pragmatic observation that it seems like male sitters are vastly overrepresented in these sorts of cases. Like it bothers me that the default Sitterycity setting is not to show men, but I think it would give me pause to hire one. Cue inner turmoil.


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 Post subject: Re: The Playground randomness thread
PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 11:34 am 
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Yes, I hear you! We used to babysit for a friend's school aged, completely potty trained kids, and she would make me promise that my husband would never be left alone with them. My husband is amazing with kids and her children adored him. but somehow she saw him as a threat just because he was a man. And its really sad, but for all we were slightly hurt and thought she was being a bit extreme, we could understand her choice in the current climate.

I think the problem is that predators seek out certain jobs - for example, priests, coaches, or mall security guards. So the thought is that you should teach your child to go to a mother with children if s/he is lost rather than to find the mall security guard. And of course, you then have predators that use females to lure children, like the kindergarten student in Philly who was taken out of her kindergarten class by a woman in a hijab, and the substitute teacher assumed the woman was her mother. It is all horrible and sad.

And with our local 66 year old, who was being arrested for the first time ever, you just have to wonder whether it really was the first time, or if he had just gotten away with it for all these years.

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 Post subject: Re: The Playground randomness thread
PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 1:09 pm 
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This is referring back to Ariann's stuff on the previous page, but just in case weighing in helps...my mother's father molested her as a teenager, and she also has a lot of anger at her mother about it. My mom explained to me pretty young that her father abused her and that's why she didn't see her parents anymore but they would give me checks for Christmas and my birthday and I still needed to write thank you notes and stuff. My mother's father has since passed away (I never met him but went to his funeral to support my mom), and while it's a little weird that my cousin had a good relationship with him and he was actually a grandfather to him (my mother's sister refused to believe my mom), I've never had a point where I wished I had had a relationship with him because why would I want that with someone who abused my mom? When I was younger I wished I knew my mom's mom but I don't care anymore and I doubt I will ever meet her. I guess my point is, extended family is great when the people are great, but don't feel like you're depriving Malka of extended family when the extended family is not worth having. Sometimes I'm sad that my mom's side of the family are all crassholes but I don't feel sad that I didn't grow up knowing them.

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 Post subject: Re: The Playground randomness thread
PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 1:53 pm 
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Tofulish wrote:
Yes, I hear you! We used to babysit for a friend's school aged, completely potty trained kids, and she would make me promise that my husband would never be left alone with them. My husband is amazing with kids and her children adored him. but somehow she saw him as a threat just because he was a man. And its really sad, but for all we were slightly hurt and thought she was being a bit extreme, we could understand her choice in the current climate.

My husband looks kind of creepy (in a homeless man/scarecrow way -- he is just really scruffy and even in a suit and with cropped hair, he looks like some kind of ex-con trying to clean up and get a job or something), so I could totally see that happening to him. That said, in an ironic twist of fate, he says everyone is WAY nicer to him when he is out with one or both of the kids.

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 Post subject: Re: The Playground randomness thread
PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 1:55 pm 
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I never have time to read the ppk anymore (boo) so I'm terribly behind on posts. But I just popped in here and read this tooth conversation and darnit, now I'm worried about kai's teeth too.

I guess the good news is even though he didn't get a tooth until he was around 1 your old, and they came in verrry slowly, now at 2.5 he's got all of them but his 2nd molars.

The bad news is he has some little brown stains on his top 2 front teeth near his gums. I'm worried they're cavities. I did nurse him to sleep until about 19 mos. and I didn't wipe his gums or anything, especially since he had hardly any teeth at that time. We've really only started brushing his teeth 2x a day, every day, over the past few months. I use Tom's silly strawberry, which has flouride in it, but only a tiny rice-sized blob. He does spit afterwards, but not very well. (and he doesn't like brushing his teeth so we usually have to forcibly do it for him)

I've been thinking I should bring him to the dentist for a while but he HATES when people try to look in his mouth. He doesn't even let me look in there, nevermind the doctor. I read online you should bring your kid to a pediatric dentist when you think they can handle it, so I figured I should wait. But now reading these posts I'm thinking maybe I should go...

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 Post subject: Re: The Playground randomness thread
PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 2:12 pm 
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Aubade wrote:
I never have time to read the ppk anymore (boo) so I'm terribly behind on posts. But I just popped in here and read this tooth conversation and darnit, now I'm worried about kai's teeth too.

I guess the good news is even though he didn't get a tooth until he was around 1 your old, and they came in verrry slowly, now at 2.5 he's got all of them but his 2nd molars.

The bad news is he has some little brown stains on his top 2 front teeth near his gums. I'm worried they're cavities. I did nurse him to sleep until about 19 mos. and I didn't wipe his gums or anything, especially since he had hardly any teeth at that time. We've really only started brushing his teeth 2x a day, every day, over the past few months. I use Tom's silly strawberry, which has flouride in it, but only a tiny rice-sized blob. He does spit afterwards, but not very well. (and he doesn't like brushing his teeth so we usually have to forcibly do it for him)

I've been thinking I should bring him to the dentist for a while but he HATES when people try to look in his mouth. He doesn't even let me look in there, nevermind the doctor. I read online you should bring your kid to a pediatric dentist when you think they can handle it, so I figured I should wait. But now reading these posts I'm thinking maybe I should go...

The recommendation here is when they've got their first tooth or by the time they are one. I highly recommend going right away, whether or not he likes the idea. We waited on our first child, and that didn't work out well for us. The sooner you can catch anything, the better!

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 Post subject: Re: The Playground randomness thread
PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 7:42 pm 
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Ugh, so L didn't brush her teeth well yesterday and was exhausted so I brushed her teeth against her will. She was so upset she threw up everything she had eaten in a giant waterfall of rancid milk that spurted out of her mouth and nose.

I am the worst parent ever.

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