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 Post subject: Re: Ventilation Station 2.0
PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2013 3:42 pm 
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Nooch of Earl
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I was raised in a family where it's really weird to share food and drink, and it took a long time for me not to be totally weirded out in social situations where people would want a sip of this or that. But really as a kid I didn't mind this at all, that's just how things were. It's only as an adult that I seem to be the weird one out (I've ranted extensively on the pet peeves thread about being brought multiple forks so I can 'share' my dessert, and as far as I'm concerned there's going to be an inedible, mid-dessert depletion region wasted in the middle if that happens).

But one of the things that I reaaaaaaaaaaaaally get driven up a wall about is when I'll go to a restaurant with people and order a communal appetizer like fries or chips and then you find out an hour later that oh they've been sick all week.


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 Post subject: Re: Ventilation Station 2.0
PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2013 4:32 pm 
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I am pretty much the least fastidious, least germ concerned parent I know, and even I think that drink sharing is horrifying, even if everyone involved seems to be well.

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 Post subject: Re: Ventilation Station 2.0
PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2013 6:19 pm 
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SIX AND A HALF YEAR OLDS. Parenting it single parenting style from the end of April til sometime in February.

Send reinforcements.

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 Post subject: Re: Ventilation Station 2.0
PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2013 6:34 pm 
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Nooch of Earl
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*hugs* deployment or geobaching?


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 Post subject: Re: Ventilation Station 2.0
PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2013 5:09 am 
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Drunk Dialed Ian MacKaye
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annak wrote:
But one of the things that I reaaaaaaaaaaaaally get driven up a wall about is when I'll go to a restaurant with people and order a communal appetizer like fries or chips and then you find out an hour later that oh they've been sick all week.

I hate communal food -- I tend to have a big appetite and I feel like communal food means you can't ever have as much as you want or else you are greedy and totally bogarting the snacks. Also, germs.

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 Post subject: Re: Ventilation Station 2.0
PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2013 10:39 am 
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Drunk Dialed Ian MacKaye
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TheCrabbyCrafter wrote:
annak wrote:
But one of the things that I reaaaaaaaaaaaaally get driven up a wall about is when I'll go to a restaurant with people and order a communal appetizer like fries or chips and then you find out an hour later that oh they've been sick all week.

I hate communal food -- I tend to have a big appetite and I feel like communal food means you can't ever have as much as you want or else you are greedy and totally bogarting the snacks. Also, germs.

Yes, this. I don't want to eat more than my fair share, but I'm usually pretty hungry! See also: going to nonvegan places where the communal food is cheese or meat based. Bleh. And yeah, germs. I tend not to get sick often, but my partner gets sick super easily so I don't want to carry any extra germs if I don't have to! Once he's sick, the kids always get it.

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 Post subject: Re: Ventilation Station 2.0
PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2013 11:59 am 
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Communal food sucks. I want to order what I want to order and eat all of what I order. :) I hate going to Ethiopian restaurants and everyone wants to just get platters for everyone to share. With that said I did eat Ethiopian last night but just with my husband and we shared. He is probably the only person I'm comfy sharing with.

My vent today is that my husband and I went out to dinner last night. Without the kids. It was magical until a couple with an about 2 year old came in with basically a tv for her to watch through the whole meal. I so needed time away from my kids, i finally get it and then I have to listen to sesame street while eating. I get that it's hard to eat out with kids but think of the other people eating in the restaurant with you please. What happened to coloring books, crayons or even pens. Re gets so excited if I whip out a pen at a restaurant. That kid is never going to learn to properly eat in a restaurant if she gets to watch a movie every time. The kid also watched the TV on the whole car ride to the restaurant (I saw them pull up) and the ride home. I have my own problems with that as well.

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 Post subject: Re: Ventilation Station 2.0
PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2013 1:07 pm 
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annak wrote:
I was raised in a family where it's really weird to share food and drink, and it took a long time for me not to be totally weirded out in social situations where people would want a sip of this or that. But really as a kid I didn't mind this at all, that's just how things were. It's only as an adult that I seem to be the weird one out (I've ranted extensively on the pet peeves thread about being brought multiple forks so I can 'share' my dessert, and as far as I'm concerned there's going to be an inedible, mid-dessert depletion region wasted in the middle if that happens).

But one of the things that I reaaaaaaaaaaaaally get driven up a wall about is when I'll go to a restaurant with people and order a communal appetizer like fries or chips and then you find out an hour later that oh they've been sick all week.

Yes, my family didn't share food or drinks either. I mostly don't share with my kids unless they're thirsty and I'm unprepared and then we might end up sharing a waterbottle. My mom scared me as a kid with a story about someone who had the contagious form of meningitus (jeez, spelling?) and they had been sharing a drink with family members before getting ill.

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 Post subject: Re: Ventilation Station 2.0
PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2013 1:26 pm 
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We (me and the twins' mom and dad) have been working on the word "share" and the two ways it's been used to far have been "no share" and "that's MY share." Don't think they're quite getting it. And they're still tackling each other to the ground several times a day over toys.

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 Post subject: Re: Ventilation Station 2.0
PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2013 3:20 pm 
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JENNA wrote:
It was magical until a couple with an about 2 year old came in with basically a tv for her to watch through the whole meal. I so needed time away from my kids, i finally get it and then I have to listen to sesame street while eating.


That's so annoying!

We have a friend whose kid begs for her to play "shushybye" on her phone non-stop. So if we get together its about ten minutes of them playing, and then increasingly louder screams for "shushybye" after which her mom gives in and the little girl watches video after video after video, because that is the only way to calm her down. It really doesn't seem like a very good pattern for anyone.

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 Post subject: Re: Ventilation Station 2.0
PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2013 3:29 pm 
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JENNA wrote:
It was magical until a couple with an about 2 year old came in with basically a tv for her to watch through the whole meal. I so needed time away from my kids, i finally get it and then I have to listen to sesame street while eating.


This is the kind of thing I always think about when I'm out with kids. How is this affecting the people around me? So many people are only concerned with how their kids are affecting them/ their meal. How can they teach their child to care about people in general of they can't even model basic politeness is public spaces?



Sorry your meal was a bummer Jenna!

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 Post subject: Re: Ventilation Station 2.0
PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2013 5:13 pm 
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I eventually tuned it out and we had a delicious ethiopian mea complete with a fresh vegan coconut cake. I would have rather had the kid walking around and saying hi to us then to be distracted by their tv thing. The restaurants owners have young children who were quietly walking around the place..it was cute and non distracting.

I'm like you Kelly I always think how what they are doing is affecting the people around us. Sometimes their rowdiness etc is fine around other people and sometimes it's not. When it's not I am not going to whip out my phone or ipad for them to play on/watch something. It teaches them nothing. I see 11 year olds at restaurants using those devices. They should be able to sit with there family and eat dinner without a device in their hands.

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 Post subject: Re: Ventilation Station 2.0
PostPosted: Fri Jul 12, 2013 12:19 pm 
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yeah Jenna I kinda agree - maybe it's appropriate when you're in a real pinch and need a quiet kid for an emergency eating out, but I feel like kids need to learn to wait and be patient and polite in public. Not every place is a playground you know? We rarely eat out at restaurants and I've noticed that Dahlia doesn't "get" that you have to wait for your food etc so that's something I want to work on...besides I know it's probably silly and early for her but I like for her to be able to sit and make conversation with us!


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 Post subject: Re: Ventilation Station 2.0
PostPosted: Fri Jul 12, 2013 12:34 pm 
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I don't think that's silly at all Audrey! This is the perfect time for them to learn to sit and have a conversation with you. If you just give them electronics to play with at dinner then they will turn into the 11 year old kid who still uses them at dinner. I grew up where we sat at the table and talked about our day and I loved it. My kids are going to do that also.

There are very rare moments where I could see whipping out an iphone/ipad for kids. Like if we were at a wedding or funeral or something that really requires them to sit and be quiet. We are fortunate enough to never really have to bring them to any of those types of things and the few times that we had to whosever family it was for the non related parent takes the kids outside if they can't behave. Also when Reno was about 3 she was fully capable of being polite and quite during those types of things because she learned to be.

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 Post subject: Re: Ventilation Station 2.0
PostPosted: Fri Jul 12, 2013 1:15 pm 
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Ada scratched Alice's head twice before. This was in the middle of a crazy throw everything to the ground/climb on everything/bite and pinch and scratch everyone because I'm tired but I won't go to sleep meltdown. Everything I told her not to do or stop doing she kept doing more. She had a time out that she sat for and when it was over got up and did exactly what she had the time out for. Anyway, Alice needed to nurse and I thought Ada was calm but then she bit me. And then went for Alice's head and scratched her. So I put my arm up to stop her and she basically gnawed on my arm. Seriously, it took everything in me not to push her or something. Normally she is really loving towards Alice and just wants to kiss her all day. She was clearly doing this (and everything else) to get a reaction out of me. I finally got her to sleep now but I don't even know what to do anymore.


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 Post subject: Re: Ventilation Station 2.0
PostPosted: Fri Jul 12, 2013 1:23 pm 
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I don't think every moment has to be turned into a learning lesson. Some of the comments here are pretty judgy about parents using ipads or whatever to entertain the kids. Well sometimes electronic entertainment is a life saver. If you don't like it for your kid or if it is too loud and interfering with your experience then complain about that, but it would be nice if people weren't just putting other parents down for not teaching their child a lesson while they try to eat. We teach our children all day long but sometimes you just need a break from having your hair pulled while you eat.


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 Post subject: Re: Ventilation Station 2.0
PostPosted: Fri Jul 12, 2013 2:15 pm 
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I'm in the middle on this. I don't think anyone should ever give their kids a noisy ipod/ipad in a restaurant. If you give it to them at all, silence it at least. I also believe kids should learn to converse at meals and practice patience, etc. If they don't learn it young, it will be foreign to them!

As someone who has a little kid with them 24/7, no babysitting, I definitely know that sometimes you absolutely need something distracting for your kids to do to make it through whatever you are doing. Silas has sensory issues so he doesn't always have the self-control he needs to have. He's usually fine now, but age 2-3 we definitely used ipad apps to entertain him so that we could watch Shae's soccer games or if we were really off track with his schedule (a sensory kid who is tired/hungry is a perfect storm!), sometimes even in restaurants. Never with sound, never in a way that could disturb other people. Almost always educational games with one of us commenting and helping along the way.

I hate when things are extremes only. I always think middle ground and balance is the way to go.

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 Post subject: Re: Ventilation Station 2.0
PostPosted: Fri Jul 12, 2013 2:37 pm 
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I really appreciate your comment, and I definitely agree that we shouldn't be judging other parents. Electronic equipment has its place, for sure, and I'd never judge anyone for using it to keep your child distracted during a long flight etc.

That said, at least for me and Leela, I can't see how rewarding bad behavior, like pulling hair or yelling, by giving her something she wants, like a video, is going to be useful in the long-run. We set very clear limits - I wouldn't tolerate L pulling my hair or biting or yelling. The response to that is a warning and if its not heeded, then we go home. She hit me in the face with a toy at the pool, because she wasn't being careful, and I told her the next time it happened, we were going straight home. And she stopped because she has had the experience that that limit will be enforced. It sucks sometimes, but she learns quickly if the boundaries are clear and enforced.

As Kelly says, its about balance. I really liked this piece in the NYT - about how teaching your kids to have self-control and be conscious of the needs of others ultimately has them grow up to be happier adults. http://parenting.blogs.nytimes.com/2013 ... very-rule/

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 Post subject: Re: Ventilation Station 2.0
PostPosted: Fri Jul 12, 2013 3:23 pm 
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I think it's important to recognize that going out to eat is not a necessity. I have a 2.5 year old and twin 4.5 month olds. We occasionally all go out for a very casual lunch, but never dinner since handling all 3 at the end of the day is usually pretty crazy so I would never inflict that on other diners. My husband and I don't have many date nights, so if we arrange care for them and go out to dinner, I am going to be very peeved if I have to sit next to rowdy kids or listen to kiddie TV (assuming this is a "nice" restaurant, not a super casual one).


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 Post subject: Re: Ventilation Station 2.0
PostPosted: Sat Jul 13, 2013 6:42 pm 
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Nooch of Earl
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I'd rather V be playing an ipad game than jumping out of the seat, making noise, or otherwise bothering other diners. Though obviously I keep the volume down.


ETA: I haven't been to a nice restaurant in years, so yes these are casual places.


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 Post subject: Re: Ventilation Station 2.0
PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 10:31 am 
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annak wrote:
I'd rather V be playing an ipad game than jumping out of the seat, making noise, or otherwise bothering other diners. Though obviously I keep the volume down.


ETA: I haven't been to a nice restaurant in years, so yes these are casual places.


Indeed. We haven't actually used the iPad with Malka in a restaurant yet, but that's more about our chronic disorganization (the reason we eat out so much in the first place) than any philosophical bias against it - and luckily she doesn't even seem to notice when the volume is off. That'd be awesome if I could teach my 22 month old to be chill and sit like a normal person and engage during a meal, but yeah right.


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 Post subject: Re: Ventilation Station 2.0
PostPosted: Wed Jul 17, 2013 9:55 am 
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Drunk Dialed Ian MacKaye
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Twice this week, Beetroot has put his hand into my drink before I could even have a sip. Earlier in the week, it was my fizzy mineral water with a splash of bitters. Just now, it was this Bigelow probiotic tea that my friend sent me from the U.S. ARGH!!! I wash his hands every day, but he's always scratching his butt and tugging on his penis and even though he's my kid and I love him, I dumped the drinks out. I do not want my drinks being fondled!

Maybe this seems petty, but it's wasteful and it's hard enough to pour a drink one-handed (baby in the other arm). And I'm extra thirsty from boobing Vax all the time.
grumble grumble.

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 Post subject: Re: Ventilation Station 2.0
PostPosted: Wed Jul 17, 2013 10:35 am 
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Drunk Dialed Ian MacKaye
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Totally valid, crabby. When my boys do that, I dump my drinks too. Really don't want penis/bum germs in my beverages either! That sucks that it happened with something special from far away though. And it really is difficult when you're doing it all one-handed.

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 Post subject: Re: Ventilation Station 2.0
PostPosted: Wed Jul 17, 2013 12:09 pm 
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Last night at dinner Livi started weeping because "I LIKE sleep now but it's so hard for me to go to sleep!" and then she just sobbed a bit.

annak wrote:
*hugs* deployment or geobaching?


Stay strong and keep busy!


deployed again - 4th time.

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 Post subject: Re: Ventilation Station 2.0
PostPosted: Wed Jul 17, 2013 12:53 pm 
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Nooch of Earl
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appifanie wrote:
Last night at dinner Livi started weeping because "I LIKE sleep now but it's so hard for me to go to sleep!" and then she just sobbed a bit.

annak wrote:
*hugs* deployment or geobaching?


Stay strong and keep busy!


deployed again - 4th time.



Yuck!! It's amazing how much tougher it is with a kid. I hope you have lots of help! Mine will be home in a few weeks (our deployment got extended, feh) and I'm so looking forward to it.. as much to wash my hands of policing the command-wide spouse dramas as to have my husband back! This looks like it'll be our last deployment for a few years, though, since they've put my husband up for a shore job in DC in january. Back and forth like Sisyphus!


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