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 Post subject: Cinnamon Snail needs a new truck!
PostPosted: Mon Apr 14, 2014 4:02 pm 
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the truck they've been using for 4 years is laid up, and they've just launched a Kickstarter to fund a new one. only 14 days for this campaign, so step lively! https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/13 ... nail-shell

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 Post subject: Re: Cinnamon Snail needs a new truck!
PostPosted: Fri Apr 18, 2014 9:30 am 
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I can't believe they will be shut down during my visit - soooo sad. :(


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 Post subject: Re: Cinnamon Snail needs a new truck!
PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 6:51 pm 
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God they need more than $40,000 more in just over a week? What happens if they don't reach it! Can't some celebrity bankroll the rest!! ahhhh so scared!!!!!

I pledged the amount that gets you a free lunch but i REALLY want the 6-foot version! lolol

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 Post subject: Re: Cinnamon Snail needs a new truck!
PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 6:59 pm 
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i hope they make the money, but looking at the rewards, i really think they should have tried to make them more worth their monetary value if they wanted the money that fast. yes i want them to be in business, but they aren't a charity. maybe a rich person really would want to give them $10,000, so why did they basically make that reward level a joke? i'm a little annoyed at the tone of the whole thing. it doesn't seem like they are taking it very seriously and they are taking it for granted that people would be donating their (potentially) hard earned money. make a video with your name in it for $50? sigh. and for $10, they really should at least give you a coupon for 2 free donuts or something.
i know i'm a grumpus. i just get tired of reading about kickstarters where it seems like everyone is just assuming they will meet the goal instead of being super appreciative of people's help.

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 Post subject: Re: Cinnamon Snail needs a new truck!
PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 7:31 pm 
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I agree. Why not ship some things? Come up with a product (like cookies based off their best donut flavors) and offer that in exchange. I bet a lot of people would pledge $20 for a little box of cookies in a unique flavor.

Also, they didn't pay their vehicle registration on time? They lose my sympathy on that one. That is a known, recurring expense and detail that you plan for. Weird.

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 Post subject: Re: Cinnamon Snail needs a new truck!
PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 8:48 pm 
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I think doing Kickstart rewards is difficult. People want a lot for their donation but as a business trying to raise money it isn't easy to realistically offer much. If you're using kickstart to get capital to produce an item you will sell, you can offer your (perhaps dubious) tech device as a reward because that's your goal. (And even then it isn't always a great idea). But if they need that much money for a truck they don't have that much to spend on giving away free food or t shirts or what have you. And shipping stuff out in big numbers is expensive and time consuming. Tack on the taxes, kickstart fees and amazun credit card fees, and you need to raise a lot more money than you actually need to fulfill all your kickstart related expenses before you even start to launch or improve your business.

The best rewards from a business standpoint are those that are low cost (such as that video or stickers or a postcard). And likely the things people are least interested in getting for their money.

It's funny that you said they aren't a charity, but for the kickstart to work best for a business like this it actually would be if people treated them like a charity and just gave them money. I'd never thought of it that way before. I wonder if getting a small business loan is still too difficult/high interest to be worth it. I'd like to see a cost analysis of loan interest vs kickstart fees inclusive of rewards, taxes, etc.

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 Post subject: Re: Cinnamon Snail needs a new truck!
PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 9:10 pm 
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that's a good point, panders. you're definitely right about them needing the money and i know people end up going broke over kickstarter rewards that were really too elaborate/expensive. maybe kickstarter isn't a good medium for this sort of thing? where there isn't a physical product being produced? i don't really know. it was probably smart of them not to go overboard on the rewards that they might not be able to fulfill. I might just be too cynical about kickstarter in general, which is probably because i rarely feel like i can afford to donate money to a business when there are charities that i'd prefer to donate to when i have the money.

if you have the money, i think it's great to help out small businesses, but if this is going to become the new model for starting a business, i will probably just have to get on board!

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 Post subject: Re: Cinnamon Snail needs a new truck!
PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 9:37 pm 
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I agree. Kickstarter definitely works better when it's kind of like a preorder of a thing (and that's usually the only kind I back). I've supported quite a few that actually allowed backers to get the book/album/whatever cheaper than it would have been once it went on real sale.

But I think Kickstarter recently changed some of their policies. I was looking to do one a few years ago and it explicitly said you can't use Kickstarter to raise money for an experience or a business; it had to be a creative endeavor. I don't see the business part in the language anymore (possibly because people were misusing it so often anyway by saying they were writing a book or a blog or something about the project and what you were actually paying for was that creative thing, not the business).

Despite it not being a preorder type thing (and despite deciding I'd never back another vegan Kickstarter because of the 50 I've backed, they have the worst track record on rewards), I did back this one because 1. while the Snail isn't a charity, they so so much for charities that it seems worth it to me. They're also probably the only eatery that I would credit with actually making vegan food more accessible and mainstream. And 2. I know and trust these dudes.

ETA: I just remembered that they Instagrammed a set of really good looking knives that were supposed to be backer rewards, so they may have other "thing" rewards in store. I don't know why they haven't posted them on the page yet. Maybe when they hit a certain goal.


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 Post subject: Re: Cinnamon Snail needs a new truck!
PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 9:48 pm 
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that's a good point, ssd, about all the charity work they do. i was just remembering everything they did after Sandy.
there are a lot of ways to look at this! but i do hope they make their goal.

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 Post subject: Re: Cinnamon Snail needs a new truck!
PostPosted: Sun Apr 20, 2014 9:48 pm 
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I think Kickstart has made it seem easy to get a lot of money for free. But if you don't have a strong business plan in place, all that money going to a start up cost or expansion does not mean that the business will be able to turn a profit to stay in business, or even be able to start up. There have been several campaigns here that were successfully funded but then couldn't start because they didn't actually have enough money or long term planning to make it work.
I am very cynical about the kickstart too, which is why I don't back things anymore and try to instead spend my money at the places I want to succeed by buying their goods and services. And any of this is not a comment on the Cinnamon Snail; I don't know their business plan or expenses at all. I just read a lot about Kickstart and am interested in their business model. When you start to research it, you can see that it might not be such a great idea. Kind of like the groupon fad of a few years ago.

I love the idea of community funding to help a small business get off the ground but the reality of it is of course a lot more messy than that.

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 Post subject: Re: Cinnamon Snail needs a new truck!
PostPosted: Sun Apr 20, 2014 9:49 pm 
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SeitanSaidDance wrote:
They're also probably the only eatery that I would credit with actually making vegan food more accessible and mainstream.

I would like to know what they do in this regard. I left NYC right as they opened and never got to go, but I've read about them giving out food after Sandy and would love to know more if you have any links.

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 Post subject: Re: Cinnamon Snail needs a new truck!
PostPosted: Mon Apr 21, 2014 12:11 am 
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pandacookie wrote:
I think Kickstart has made it seem easy to get a lot of money for free. But if you don't have a strong business plan in place, all that money going to a start up cost or expansion does not mean that the business will be able to turn a profit to stay in business, or even be able to start up. There have been several campaigns here that were successfully funded but then couldn't start because they didn't actually have enough money or long term planning to make it work.


I agree with all of this, and it's why I have stopped giving to Kickstarter. Several things I've given too (most frustratingly, a vegan cheese company) never followed through on their rewards, and it appears to be because they didn't actually have a solid business plan.

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 Post subject: Re: Cinnamon Snail needs a new truck!
PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 9:43 am 
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I agree with nearly everything panda said in the post above this one too. I still do back many Kickstarter projects, but not businesses, just creative projects, which is what it was originally intended for.

pandacookie wrote:
SeitanSaidDance wrote:
They're also probably the only eatery that I would credit with actually making vegan food more accessible and mainstream.

I would like to know what they do in this regard. I left NYC right as they opened and never got to go, but I've read about them giving out food after Sandy and would love to know more if you have any links.

Here's VegNews about Sandy: http://vegnews.com/articles/page.do?pageId=5172&catId=8

If I remember correctly, they were off the streets for a week, then did a week of free food, then did free food every Saturday for over a month.

In terms of mainstreaming vegan food, if you get there after 11 AM, the line is always long, and based on overhearing people in the line, most aren't vegan, they're just random people in the area who were shocked vegan food could be good. Based on liking the Snail, coworkers have come to me, excited that a vegan restaurant is opening in their neighborhood, asking if I want to go. They've won pretty much every food truck award in NY and NJ. I think what really made me realize they were really something special is when they wound up on Yelp's list of the top 100 eateries in the country: http://officialblog.yelp.com/2014/02/ye ... s-now.html They don't even have real walls and people voted them one of the top 100 places to eat in the whole country. That's nuts!


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 Post subject: Re: Cinnamon Snail needs a new truck!
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2014 7:53 pm 
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Hi, I work for the Snail, and I saw the ppk in the list of referrals to the Kickstarter project.
And so I wanted to say thank you!

Personally, I've backed a couple KS projects in the last year or so. It's fun to look at projects and decide to be part of one. Personally I think it's ultimately a bad idea to think of it (at least as the backer) as a preorder system because KS doesn't guarantee you anything.
There are a couple horror stories out there... some guy got his book project funded, got the book printed, ran out of money shipping them, and straight up posted a video of him burning some copies of it that he said he couldn't afford to ship.
So far, so good for what I've backed.

I don't want to go through and respond to everything everyone said cause that's annoying, but if anybody would like to ask me stuff, please do!


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 Post subject: Re: Cinnamon Snail needs a new truck!
PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 11:55 am 
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Looks like they exceeded their goal, congrats to the Snail peeps! Great news for all of us too.


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