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 Post subject: Re: Very Special Customers/Clients
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 7:59 pm 
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But that's what he was presumedly trying to do by asking her out - establish a personal relationship. I just don't see much difference between asking someone out via phonecall or waiting until their store closes and stopping them on their way out. Both could be very creepy!

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 Post subject: Re: Very Special Customers/Clients
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 8:19 pm 
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I think its because both waitstaff and salespeople (and perhaps people in the service industry generally) have to be really nice to you to do their jobs, and you put on a professional "mask" to do your job. So it feels weird when someone mistakes you doing your job for being interested. Because that professional persona is just not you.

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 Post subject: Re: Very Special Customers/Clients
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 8:49 pm 
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Also when you are at work you are somewhat trapped!


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 Post subject: Re: Very Special Customers/Clients
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 9:08 pm 
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I personally wouldn't like it if someone waited until after I was out of work either, that's a bit stalkerish to me and I would feel extremely uncomfortable.

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 Post subject: Re: Very Special Customers/Clients
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 9:20 pm 
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I do agree, but I can see how at least waiting until you are off your shift means that he is engaging with you as a private persona not as your work persona, and that kind of puts you on a more even footing - you're two individuals rather than the sales person and the customer so there is less of a power dynamic differential? I just think its a boundaries thing.

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 Post subject: Re: Very Special Customers/Clients
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 10:22 pm 
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but there's also the phone versus in person thing . . . with the phone being less invasive, and he could have been thinking about this. I can see both (all) sides. I do hear that missdelaney felt violated and creeped out! Regardless, it sounds like the guy got missdelaney's message loud and clear and hopefully won't be bothering her again.


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 Post subject: Re: Very Special Customers/Clients
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 10:46 pm 
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That's actually sort of how I met my ex-husband. I was working in a record/video rental store and he'd been in a couple of times (I helped him find U2's "Rattle & Hum" to rent, sold him a CD, etc...) Then one day he called me up at work after he left and asked if he could come talk to me on my break. We hung out outside and chatted for 15 minutes, exchanged numbers and made a date and the rest was history, at least until I divorced him. I dunno... there are things that seem super creepy coming from the wrong person and super sweet coming from the right one. I'd sort of hate to be a dude because there's still the societal expectation that you'll be the initiator in hetero dating interactions and you have to put yourself out on a limb without knowing if you're being a creep or not (sometimes... some people manage to be unequivocally creepy!)

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 Post subject: Re: Very Special Customers/Clients
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 11:56 pm 
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Yeah, I don't see anything creepy in his behavior (assuming he respected the no and haven't called again!) - I mean, sometimes you meet someone, and you feel like you just click.. Wouldn't it be a shame not to at least try? I mean, that's what he did! He just tried. I mean, I totally get that being confronted with something you didn't ask for (here; having to say no to someone asking you out) when you haven't done anything to initiate that can feel violating, but I also don't think that he was doing anything wrong.. It may feel super awkward and uncomfortable, but all he really did was to try to ask you out. As long as he is respectful and graceful about the no, it was just a random encounter with a random stranger who wasn't a total douchebag.


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 Post subject: Re: Very Special Customers/Clients
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 2:39 am 
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missdelaney wrote:
lepelaar wrote:
creep wrote:
What's so bad about this? I mean, maybe it's a little weird that he called your work instead of asking in person, but it seems like a perfectly reasonable way to ask someone out. It doesn't sound vulgar or creepy or whatever...


Yeah, I agree. As long as he can take "no" for an answer, this seems like a not unreasonable thing to do. If you had found him attractive too and had said yes, I think it would be a perfectly charming "how we met" story.


Maybe it's the industry I'm in, but this is crossing so many lines, even if I was attracted to him, too. It made me very uncomfortable that this man assumed he could call me at work to ask me to get a drink when I was simply doing my job. The problem is that I work in a male-dominated industry in sales. Maybe this doesn't make others uncomfortable, but this is not an appropriate thing to do in any way- I regularly get hit on just because I'm doing my job well, and they misconstrue a woman in sales as a woman who's apparently flirting with them.
I've been asked out at work and said yes, but only after those people made damn sure. The last one to do it actually waited until we were closed- he walked up with me as I was putting our closed sign out and asked for my number so I was technically off the clock.

To each their own. This made me feel awful.


Fair enough, and I absolutely respect that this felt inappropriate to you. For me, when I was working retail (which I did for the last 15 years up until April this year, and probably will again soon), having someone ask me out at work felt a lot less threatening and line-crossing than being approached by a customer outside of work. It felt to me like a safe, liminal zone between work and private life, where they could test the waters and find out if I was interested in getting to know them outside of a work situation, and like they were being respectful that I might not want to cross that line (as long as they could take "no" for an answer). The few times I got approached by customers outside of work, it felt much more like a violation because they already crossed that line into my private life without my permission. Like, dude, just because I'm nice to you at work doesn't give you license to corner me in the tram and ask me all kinds of personal questions. Or approach me on OKCupid because you "know" me from the bookstore. And if someone came up to me to ask me out while I was closing the shop, that would really set off alarm bells for me. That would feel really unsafe to me because we often closed much later than any other stores and at that point my co-workers would all be running off to get home and I'd be alone with this person. During the working day, at least my co-workers were around and could back me up if someone DID cross a line.

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 Post subject: Re: Very Special Customers/Clients
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 11:07 am 
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Awh this conversation is making me a bit sad! I think it's so sweet when someone goes out on a limb and asks people out, wherever they do it. I mean, if you do meet someone at thier place of employment and get crush-y for them, what's a person to do? Just say "awh fork it, they were probably just putting on a customer service mask and really they're probably a huge bisque"? That's not very pleasant of a thought.

I'm sorry to be saying this when part of the reason missdelaney posted this was saying that it imparted to her terrible day. That sucks that you had a bad day, truly. Not trying to make you feel guilty for your reaction. But I sympathize I suppose with feeling lonely, so I think it's very courageous to just give it a shot to ask someone out. Not to mention someone totally asked me out while I was at work a week ago and it led to two great dates and me being totally crushed out.

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 Post subject: Re: Very Special Customers/Clients
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 11:15 am 
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I feel like we're never going to come to a "great understanding" and I think we should just end it here because obviously some people wouldn't mind and others would.

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 Post subject: Re: Very Special Customers/Clients
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 12:54 pm 
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If the conversation goes too far afield or becomes abusive, the mods will...moderate. That's what they do.

I think that respectful disagreements and discussions of opposing views are useful in helping people flesh out their own faults. This is clearly an issue that does not really have one right answer.

I have been asked out by patrons; sometimes it's creepy and inappropriate and sometimes not.

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 Post subject: Re: Very Special Customers/Clients
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 1:05 pm 
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Sorry but I don't see the part where she asked people for their opinion on her feelings. If she felt a certain way, that's not wrong and this is all starting to sound like people telling her she can't feel a certain way because they feel otherwise. I think she's made it pretty clear how she feels and I think others have made it pretty clear that they don't. I don't think we need to keep bringing it up and I don't think she needs to keep defending herself and how she feels.

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 Post subject: Re: Very Special Customers/Clients
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 1:27 pm 
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Years ago, I had a flirtation with this guy who worked in a retail shop I frequented and one time, in the course of handing over my money while cashing out, I handed him a note with my number and an invitation to call me. He did and we dated for a couple of months. It's nerve wracking to work up the nerve to ask folks out and express a deeper interest, for sure.

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 Post subject: Re: Very Special Customers/Clients
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 1:48 pm 
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Mr. Shankly wrote:
If she felt a certain way, that's not wrong and this is all starting to sound like people telling her she can't feel a certain way because they feel otherwise. I think she's made it pretty clear how she feels and I think others have made it pretty clear that they don't.

None of those things seem to be happening though. And it's interesting to me to see people's different takes on different matters. Seems like most people are being awfully respectful. Why not let a discussion happen? There's no need to meta mod the boards unto no interaction.

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 Post subject: Re: Very Special Customers/Clients
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 1:57 pm 
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pandacookie wrote:
Mr. Shankly wrote:
If she felt a certain way, that's not wrong and this is all starting to sound like people telling her she can't feel a certain way because they feel otherwise. I think she's made it pretty clear how she feels and I think others have made it pretty clear that they don't.

None of those things seem to be happening though. And it's interesting to me to see people's different takes on different matters. Seems like most people are being awfully respectful. Why not let a discussion happen? There's no need to meta mod the boards unto no interaction.


That's this particular mod's take on the situation. In another thread, this discussion might be out of place, but this is a thread where people are posting anecdotes they feel represent particularly entitled/amusing/out-of-line customers, not a safe space. Sure, the poster maybe didn't explicitly ask for opinions, but this IS a discussion thread, and the implication of posting in this thread is that judgment is passed on the behavior discussed. I think it's fair enough to talk about that judgment, particularly where it concerns an activity that it appears multiple board members have engaged in without ill intent.

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 Post subject: Re: Very Special Customers/Clients
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 2:52 pm 
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Last night a belligerent drunk guy pretty much puked on me at a wedding. We have STUPID liquor laws that allow us to only serve beer/wine/hard liquor in a tent outside our ciderhouse (we are a cidery/farm), while the cider is served inside, so it is really hard to not over-serve since the satellite bar is so far away (pretty much in a forest), and at 1 am when I'm freaking out at some jerk to not smoke in the tent and light our premises on fire and to shut the fork up because it's a quiet, farmland, residential area and the cops come all the time, this other guy snatched an open wine bottle and downed it and then puked and yes, some got on me. It was really shitty and depressing because it was a really beautiful wedding (a same sex couple and the brides were adorable/so happy). The thing that pissed me off the most is their apologies. "It must really suck to just be a server." fork you! I am a grown asparagus woman with two degrees under my belt and you have no idea why I am choosing to be serving at a wedding or what I do with the rest of my time. I quite frequently get treated like "the help" and I don't really care, but with some dude's salmon puke on my dress I was pretty pissed.


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 Post subject: Re: Very Special Customers/Clients
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 3:33 pm 
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Vijita, nasty! I've never been puked on at any of my jobs and I hope I never will be.

I just had one of our "regulars" come in. He is a mentally ill homeless man who has one leg and reeks of urine. He threw a tantrum because his benefits check wasn't ready for him to pick up (although he never calls ahead to see if it's ready for him), so I had to just ignore him. I feel bad for him and the fact that he is obviously ill, but there's only so much I can do.

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 Post subject: Re: Very Special Customers/Clients
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 3:48 pm 
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Ugh, I'm sorry that happened to you vijita. And how is that an apology??!

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 Post subject: Re: Very Special Customers/Clients
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 5:23 pm 
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It was kind of ironic because my mum puked on me last weekend for a severe medical reason, and I kind of thought for a second that maybe I should be a nurse or a paramedic because I just roll with the puke. When I was in ER with my mum in Vancouver a patient puked all over the place and I helped the nurses clean it up.

Oh! And when I went inside my office to change my shirt, I caught a VERY drunk guest stealing three bottles of wine (from the next night's wedding!) and taking them in to the bathroom. I grabbed the keys to the washroom and busted in on her and very likely saved her life. She was falling over and our restrooms have cement floors.

Humans are weird.


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 Post subject: Re: Very Special Customers/Clients
PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2013 12:50 am 
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Eurgh. Vomit. No thanks!


I don't mind the other opinions. My brother-in-law had the same opinion. I will say the guy who "followed" me did not follow me at all. We were closing and he walked up the stairs with me (we have an actual sign we put out saying 'open' or 'closed'), after months of us talking for ten-fifteen minute increments of time before his lessons. It made sense that he would feel like it was appropriate to ask me out, and, even if I didn't want to date him, it wouldn't have been uncomfortable for me at all.
This gentlemen spent ten minutes talking to me about guitars, was 15 to 20 years older than me (I'm 21), and then left. That was our entire interaction.
The store where I work, I am the youngest by about ten years. One of two unmarried or longterm relationship folks.
Partially, it is my personal comfort levels. Partially, it is the myriad of reasons why it is inappropriate for the very specific place I work. I get asked out a whole forking lot, since I'm a superspecialgirl who works with guitars (eyeroll). Mostly, it's annoying, sometimes it's flattering, rarely is it uncomfortable. This whole interaction just felt...wrong to me.

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 Post subject: Re: Very Special Customers/Clients
PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2013 9:59 am 
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I have one really high maintenance client and she texted me to call her and even though I know that it's not going to be anything bad I'm just dreading calling her. So I've been putting it off by reading the PPK. I hate that gut churning anxiety. I also feel like I shouldn't have to deal with her on my personal time and I have this morning and afternoon off. Better get it over with. Sigh.

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 Post subject: Re: Very Special Customers/Clients
PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2013 10:25 am 
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can't you text her back and say you'll be "in the office" at x time, and will call her then?

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 Post subject: Re: Very Special Customers/Clients
PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2013 10:41 am 
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She wants me to do something extra and I don't feel like doing it. I should just text her that I can't do it and I'll call her tonight when I'm working. I know I'm being over anxious but I can't seem to stop that.

I need chocolate. :)

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 Post subject: Re: Very Special Customers/Clients
PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2013 12:15 pm 
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We had an angry man call because he wanted us to remove a family of foxes from his street. We told him it is illegal in Massachusetts to trap and relocate healthy wildlife. He started yelling that "it is ILLEGAL for wildlife to be in a residential area!" So, we should go give those foxes a ticket, I guess. Then he got really angry and said that he was going to "report you to Giuliani!". Rudy Giuliani? I guess we'll just have to wait and find out!


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