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 Post subject: Re: Relationship advice, decisions, smiles or tears
PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 6:26 pm 
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I'm so sorry torque, I've read your various comments here and in the Playground and it sounds like you are not in a good place. I hope you can figure a way out and the end result is happiness for you.

I'm sorry missdelaney. It sounds like you made the right move and I wish you luck.

In terms of 'where is this going' discussions, my husband and I figured that out pretty early mostly because we were long distance. At month 2, we discussed 1 of us moving and at month 3, we decided I'd be moving and at month 5 we both moved to the same city to be together. We had talked from the beginning about being committed to eachother but I wasn't moving unless we were going to be serious and really consider a long term plan. Then around 1 year into the relationship, we discussed getting married and a few months later we were. It all went very fast it seems.

And in terms of my recent frustration... nothing big but sometimes my husband backpedals and I get annoyed. I asked him about going to a conference in early June, he was all supportive, I found cheap plane tickets and an inexpensive hotel, which I'll share with another woman and then my husband tells me that it doesn't make sense that I am going. Maybe he should've told me that before I bought plane tickets. Now he is back to being supportive but I'm dreading the backpedal again.

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 Post subject: Re: Relationship advice, decisions, smiles or tears
PostPosted: Tue Mar 19, 2013 11:06 am 
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missdelaney, it sounds like you two made the right decision. I'm actually really glad for you that you were able to do that, instead of, like you said, wasting 2 years (or more) on 'who knows/I don't know'. I have definitely had problems with that in the past.

On that same tack, the manfriend and I were having another discussion the other night about why I stayed in all these bad relationships where I was treated poorly, and I think I finally figured it out. I always just kind of figured I was a coward and didn't want to be alone (which is definitely part of it, and are things I have worked on), but us talking around it really made me realize some things. I've never been with anyone before that I didn't hope that some part of them would eventually change. With the ex I was engaged to, I always just sort of figured eventually he would grow up and have a stable job situation and stop smoking so much damned pot (I don't care what others do, but it's not for me, so I want a partner that also feels that way, and he just smoked constantly, and spent so much money on it...), and it took me a long time to realize that those things were never going to happen. And then with my most recent ex, I sort of always thought that he would work through his anger issues, that he would try to achieve his goals, that he would work out the drama with his son, but...nope. Never did. So really, my problem is just that I'm so darned hopeful. shiitake, I even have 'Hope' tattooed on my chest, people! And I'm naive in a lot of ways, too.

So anyway, I told all this to the manfriend, but then told him that the opposite was happening with him. That I was spending a lot of time hoping that he doesn't change because there is nothing about him that I would want to be different! So, that.

Also, I had a dream last night that he died and that no one understood why I was so upset, because no one knew we were together in the first place and so I didn't get to be a part of any of the stuff that happens after someone dies and I just desperately wanted something of his to remember him by, but no one would let me into his house. It was terrible and I woke up with a pounding heart...went to get my phone to call him to make sure he was ok (you never know!) and right as I picked it up, he sent me a text with the solution to the crossword puzzle we did after dinner so I could check the answers. Swoon.

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 Post subject: Re: Relationship advice, decisions, smiles or tears
PostPosted: Tue Mar 19, 2013 11:20 am 
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That all sounds a lot like me and past relationships, allularpunk. With my ex-husband it wasn't so much waiting and hoping for him to change, but I definitely hung on because I was idealizing our relationship. The last one I really was telling myself what a great guy he'll be when he grows up. But I didn't need to waste three years of my life on someone who was an emotional adolescent. With biker boy it's been so easy because I'm not waiting for him to be the man I want. I met the man I want. Isn't it great to find that in a person?

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 Post subject: Re: Relationship advice, decisions, smiles or tears
PostPosted: Tue Mar 19, 2013 11:40 am 
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Yes, it is!

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 Post subject: Re: Relationship advice, decisions, smiles or tears
PostPosted: Tue Mar 19, 2013 8:47 pm 
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Is there a thing where in small spans of time 3 different past partners independently become engaged or married? For the most part, I'm really happy for all of them, but at the same time feel like it highlights where I don't have my life together. I graduate professional school in a year and don't know where I'll be after that, so I feel wrong about dating people with that uncertainty looming over.


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 Post subject: Re: Relationship advice, decisions, smiles or tears
PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 11:28 am 
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Ugh, 'tis the season where his training and race schedule butt up against my training and race schedule and we don't get to see enough of each other. By the time I see him on Sunday it will have been a week. Next week will be better though. We seriously need to live together.

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 Post subject: Re: Relationship advice, decisions, smiles or tears
PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 11:44 am 
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Not seeing each other enough is the worst, mtoes! Here's hoping next week comes quickly.

My guy has decided to give me a drawer/cabinet in his bathroom. He was stressing over which drawer to give me and what it would mean, and I had no idea what he was talking about. Like, top, middle, or bottom drawer, don't care, just gotta have a place to put some stuff, dude! Then we went and looked at the unit, and on either side there is a nicely sized cabinet with a little drawer below it that is just perfect. Anyway, he doesn't have anything at all in the thing, so I don't see what the big deal is, but I know it's symbolic and blah blah blah.

So I went today and bought stuff to put in my cabinet that will make mornings and evenings easier. I had already bought a contacts case/solution and he got me a toothbrush and I have a pair of glasses over there, but things like stuff for my hair (brush, straightener, goop) and showering stuff and a couple pairs of undies and a tshirt or two. No big deal. I got little travel bottles so I didn't have to re-buy all my products and I will at some point need to do an ELF order so I have some makeup over there. What does it all mean, guys? Also, what if he dumps me after I just spent all this money on all this stuff?

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 Post subject: Re: Relationship advice, decisions, smiles or tears
PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 11:59 am 
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Mentioning drawers: The ladyfriend got a drawer under my bed a few weeks ago, but that is also the cat's favourite drawer to climb in to, which is an ongoing source of adorableness, though maybe not so good for practicality as he gets hair everywhere...


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 Post subject: Re: Relationship advice, decisions, smiles or tears
PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 12:15 pm 
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camuscando wrote:
Is there a thing where in small spans of time 3 different past partners independently become engaged or married? For the most part, I'm really happy for all of them, but at the same time feel like it highlights where I don't have my life together. I graduate professional school in a year and don't know where I'll be after that, so I feel wrong about dating people with that uncertainty looming over.


Ugh, I totally understand. It seems like for quite a while there, every time I got dumped by someone, they then began dating someone that they either ended up marrying or at least ending up in a very serious, very committed relationship with. It made me feel so awful.

Graduate school, however, is the shiitake! You are making yourself so awesome, and you are committed to your education, which is admirable! The relationship will come once you're stable. The end of graduate school is a trying time, even without any dating!

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 Post subject: Re: Relationship advice, decisions, smiles or tears
PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 2:17 pm 
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I am really angry right now. My work friend, who I once thought was one of my closest friends so I told her about my relationship with my guy (recap, he is the owner of the restaurant she works in, also my ex works there, caramel cluster, I know), PUT A NOTE ON HIS CAR saying 'please tell him soon', meaning my ex. What the fork, dude? She hates my ex, she doesn't care about my guy because she hates him too (she's a little hateful in general, honestly), this being a secret doesn't negatively affect me anymore since I no longer work there. She just wants the world to know so she can blab about it to whoever she wants, and that is so forking selfish and mean! I called her out on it, saying that the manfriend gets to decide when to tell my ex because it could affect his business if my ex quits, and that timing is really important with this. I don't love the fact that it's a secret, but it's working for now, so what the hell? She said she didn't think she was being out of line at all and that my manfriend is a selfish coward for not telling my ex right away. Um, hello, it's none of your business! Meanwhile, my dude is pissed for several reasons, one of which is that I told her at all. I really thought I could trust her and that our friendship was strong enough to weather this, but I'm learning very quickly that I was wrong. I have no desire to hang out with her again after her behavior (she was also a turd to me the other day and called me a bisque for no reason). She says I have made a liar out of her and that it affects her because she works there. I don't see how, on either count. No one is asking her any questions. I get that it's a big secret and (now realize) that I shouldn't have told her, but it's like...grow up! This is real life crepe, and she just can't handle it. Also, how does it affect her job? Because her boss is dating her friend? Her job isn't any different, she still hates it just as much as she did before. There aren't any new duties or responsibilities that are work-related.

I'm just so furious right now. I know the situation is not ideal, but she is making it so much worse. Am I wrong in feeling like she is being a crappy friend? Also, because manfriend got so worked up and pissed by her note, he cancelled the plans we had to go walk his dog. Hoping he calms down enough and doesn't hate me, so that we can go ahead with our dinner plans. I hate not knowing what is going on, and I know that in the midst of all this, it's really small and stupid, but I just want to be with him and hang out and be happy.

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 Post subject: Re: Relationship advice, decisions, smiles or tears
PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 2:56 pm 
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To be honest, it sounds like now that you no longer work there, you and your dude need to be open and honest about what's going on. Also, while it sounds like your friend is being less than awesome right now, I think her being annoyed at being put in the middle of the situation is pretty understandable. Sure, technically it doesn't (or shouldn't) affect her job, but now that she knows, she's going to have it in her mind when she has to interact with either your dude/her boss or your ex/her coworker, and she didn't get to make that call for herself. She didn't make the decision to keep any secrets, but now she has to anyway, and at work, where the stakes are higher than just if she was keeping something from another friend or acquaintance.

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 Post subject: Re: Relationship advice, decisions, smiles or tears
PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 3:02 pm 
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Thanks for putting into that perspective for me. It's been difficult to see it from her side, for whatever reason. I really just needed to vent, and now that I've calmed down, that makes a lot of sense. I feel bad that I've put her in this position. I still feel like she is being unreasonably mean to me about it, but I'm also pretty sensitive. I don't really want to pressure my guy about the decision to be more open and honest, as it ultimately affects him more than it does me. He could potentially be losing an employee that needs immediate replacing, and he seems to think that if we give it a little more of a grace period that it will take some of the sting away and that he might not quit. It's going to be difficult either way.

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 Post subject: Re: Relationship advice, decisions, smiles or tears
PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 3:23 pm 
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I don't think its that big a deal to ask a good friend to keep your confidences, and doing it with a note on your car seems to be more dramatic than the situation warrants. I don't think its that big a deal to keep some stuff private - especially if you have a rocky relationship with your ex and want to stay on good terms so you get to still see your dog etc.

Sorry your manfriend is upset. I hope he gets over it and that you can go back to being super-in-to- eachother again, like the beginning of a relationship should be. And that you get to disclose your relationship soon to everyone on your terms.

Sending you lots of supportive thoughts.

ETA: just saw your post and am glad JoPa's wise perspective helped you feel better!

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 Post subject: Re: Relationship advice, decisions, smiles or tears
PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 3:27 pm 
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Thanks, Tofulish, your wise perspective makes me feel better also!

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 Post subject: Re: Relationship advice, decisions, smiles or tears
PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 4:29 pm 
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jordanpattern wrote:
To be honest, it sounds like now that you no longer work there, you and your dude need to be open and honest about what's going on. Also, while it sounds like your friend is being less than awesome right now, I think her being annoyed at being put in the middle of the situation is pretty understandable. Sure, technically it doesn't (or shouldn't) affect her job, but now that she knows, she's going to have it in her mind when she has to interact with either your dude/her boss or your ex/her coworker, and she didn't get to make that call for herself. She didn't make the decision to keep any secrets, but now she has to anyway, and at work, where the stakes are higher than just if she was keeping something from another friend or acquaintance.


I agree with this, but I get why you are/were angry and also don't think putting a note on his car was a mature way for her to deal with it. Granted, I get that she isn't going to go up to your guy and say "hey boss, you're being shady" but if I was in her situation I would have come to you with the fact that it was putting unnecessary stress on me.

But secrets can be hard, even when they're not your own.

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 Post subject: Re: Relationship advice, decisions, smiles or tears
PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 4:49 pm 
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Moon wrote:
jordanpattern wrote:
To be honest, it sounds like now that you no longer work there, you and your dude need to be open and honest about what's going on. Also, while it sounds like your friend is being less than awesome right now, I think her being annoyed at being put in the middle of the situation is pretty understandable. Sure, technically it doesn't (or shouldn't) affect her job, but now that she knows, she's going to have it in her mind when she has to interact with either your dude/her boss or your ex/her coworker, and she didn't get to make that call for herself. She didn't make the decision to keep any secrets, but now she has to anyway, and at work, where the stakes are higher than just if she was keeping something from another friend or acquaintance.


I agree with this, but I get why you are/were angry and also don't think putting a note on his car was a mature way for her to deal with it. Granted, I get that she isn't going to go up to your guy and say "hey boss, you're being shady" but if I was in her situation I would have come to you with the fact that it was putting unnecessary stress on me.

But secrets can be hard, even when they're not your own.


I think she is acting in a very immature way, which is part of why I'm so irritated. This isn't high school, this is real life, and starting drama is just so...childish! I apologized to her for putting her in the situation she is in. She never responded. Pretty sure this friendship just went into the crapper. Honestly, though, I feel like it would have turned out the same if I had waited to tell her until we went public. She would have been furious that I kept such a huge secret from her for so long, and she'd still hate my guy. (By the way, re: her hating him, everyone hates their boss, he's not a terrible person.) No winning in this situation, friend-wise. I wish it didn't affect her in the ways that it is, but her attitude about it could really use some adjusting.

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 Post subject: Re: Relationship advice, decisions, smiles or tears
PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 7:02 pm 
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Yeah, I don't think leaving a note for your manfriend was the right way to deal with the situation even if it was unfair for her to be in that situation at all. Like, every now and then I get an urge to leave passive aggressive notes for my roommates when they're messy and need to clean up after themselves, but then I remember how forking old I am and I just straight up confront them about house issues. In my experience, notes like that almost always peas people off more than it engenders any kind of good behavior.


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 Post subject: Re: Relationship advice, decisions, smiles or tears
PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 10:26 pm 
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i do feel like relationship secrets among friends/ keeping secrets from other friends are okay, but they do need to have a time cap. i wouldn't ask anyone to hold onto that kind of info for longer than a week or two and i'd let your friend know that. it's confusing keeping those kind of secrets anyway. you slip into a casual conversation w/ someone and if you don't stay on your toes, something can slip out that would unveil the secret. so i think your friend should be able to keep your confidence respectfully, but to be respectful to her, you shouldn't ask her to hold it indefinitely.


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 Post subject: Re: Relationship advice, decisions, smiles or tears
PostPosted: Thu Mar 21, 2013 2:12 am 
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allularpunk wrote:
I think she is acting in a very immature way, which is part of why I'm so irritated. This isn't high school, this is real life, and starting drama is just so...childish!


I have another perspective on this; if it was me who was put in the situation you put your friend in, I'd be pretty pissed that someone I was friends with was acting so childish AND involving me in it. Keeping a relationship secret like that, because your boss don't want to lose an employee? Really? How does he think the ex will react when he finds out this has been going on for a while? Your ex has the right to be hurt or feel betrayed or whatever, and leave his position at the restaurant. Lying about this is totally not cool and a very immature way of handling this, in my opinion. Honestly, it's not like it will be impossible to find a new employee - there are so many people looking for jobs all of the time.

Maybe I'm biased and don't take this the wrong way, because I obviously only know the story as you've posted it here, but I totally don't see the need for keeping secrets, and I would be SO pissed if one of my friends included me in their relationship drama like that (it's happened SO many times to me, and it's totally not cool to be put in a situation like that).
But you're right, it's real life and in my opinion, being cool in real life requires that you don't sneak around in order to keep an employee by withholding information from them that could be relevant in their decision making (like whether or not to stay in a job).

Honestly, I think the whole sneaking around sounds super sketchy - why does your new guy keep insisting on keeping it a secret?
I am not trying to judge you, I know that I only know part of the story and I know that when you're in love you do what you gotta do and all that, but if I was your friend, I'd be so pissed. When people have put me in situations like that, I HAVE been really pissed. I actually stopped being best friends with a girl I'd known for a lot of years because of a situation like that. Because I don't like drama. And yes, your friend was being dramatic with the note, but it's NOTHING compared to the drama a situation like the one you and your dude has put yourselves in.


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 Post subject: Re: Relationship advice, decisions, smiles or tears
PostPosted: Thu Mar 21, 2013 9:24 am 
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I think that all of you have valid points. I don't like the secret aspect of this. I understand why he wants to keep it on the DL for now, but I don't agree with it. I don't think it's going to make it better in the long run. I also don't think he's doing it to be shady. He has introduced me to his friends and is clearly not seeing anyone else. I have a lot of mixed feelings about it, and I definitely regret telling my friend. I'm pretty sure I would have lost her either way, because she would have been pissed that I kept it a secret from her for so long, but the fact that she knows has become this huge source of drama that I never realized was going to happen. I really didn't think about the consequences of telling her, and that's my fault for sure.

Also, and I cringe to tell this because of the reaction I'm sure it will get, but for the sake of being honest: she put in her two weeks. In a note, of course!

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 Post subject: Re: Relationship advice, decisions, smiles or tears
PostPosted: Thu Mar 21, 2013 9:34 am 
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My husband and I kept our work relationship secret initially partially because we worked together. When we were ready though, we did let our management know and at that point, we felt it was ok to be open knowledge.

I know it is hard but also I'm not sure if your ex-boss is the right one to tell your ex about relationship, I don't know. It would seem that if you are on talking terms that you might want to tell him. On the other hand, you no longer work there, I'm not sure why you guy has to share his personal life with his employees.

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 Post subject: Re: Relationship advice, decisions, smiles or tears
PostPosted: Thu Mar 21, 2013 9:34 am 
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There's probably a lot going on behind the scenes that have nothing to do with your relationship that we can't possibly know anything about, and we have no frame of reference when it comes to the work environment in general there. So I don't blame your guy for not wanting to bring your relationship out in the open there (not yet, anyway), and we can only speculate on her reasons for quitting. But your ex friend needs to graduate out of note writing!

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 Post subject: Re: Relationship advice, decisions, smiles or tears
PostPosted: Thu Mar 21, 2013 9:44 am 
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Yeah, the note writing is really annoying. Face to face is the way to go for grownups! Also, she has hated her job for ages and always talks about finding something else, but never does. I assume this was the push that she felt like she needed. I hope that she finds something she loves (although I do feel as if she has unrealistic expectations when it comes to restaurant jobs). I also hope that she doesn't see this as an excuse to tell everyone she knows, now that she will have no work-related consequences.

The behind the scenes crepe is just that it is a small, privately owned (by my guy) restaurant. The people who work there are generally friends. While my guy is not friends with my ex, they have a close professional relationship. I know people are going to say that for that reason, he should not be involved with me, but our hearts are squished for each other, and we will have to deal with the consequences of that. If my ex quits, my guy will have to be prepared to hire a new manager on the spot. That's difficult to do without advertising for the job in advance. Now that my friend has quit, it will be easier to be on the lookout for a possible replacement, since he will have to interview people for her job (she was also a manager, though a slightly lesser one). It's all so stupid and complicated and I can't wait until it isn't any more, but that's up to him since it's his business that's being affected. As for me talking to my ex, I'm on the fence about it. Maybe I should be there, too, but my guy definitely wants to talk to him. In the end, I think that my ex is going to be more furious at me than at him, which I can deal with.

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 Post subject: Re: Relationship advice, decisions, smiles or tears
PostPosted: Thu Mar 21, 2013 10:31 am 
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Has it on Blue Vinyl
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Joined: Wed Jan 05, 2011 7:44 pm
Posts: 2147
If she is a close friend, she should be okay with keeping a secret like this. It shouldn't be a big deal, especially since she is not friends with the ex. I don't think you put any burden on her with this, it is not a burden to keep your relationship info private for a good friend, unless it somehow involves another good friend, which does not seem to be the case. I don't think there is anything immature about wanting to keep your relationship private. I also don't see any reason there should be a time limit on this either. If she has a problem with not being a gossip, she should talk to you about it.


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 Post subject: Re: Relationship advice, decisions, smiles or tears
PostPosted: Thu Mar 21, 2013 11:49 am 
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Drunk Dialed Ian MacKaye
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Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 3:05 pm
Posts: 1956
Location: Copenhagen, Denmark
I think there is a big difference between keeping something private and keeping it secret. This is clearly being kept secret because the boss of a restaurant don't want to lose the manager, and in my world that is totally unethical. He should be free to quit if he wants to. Keeping it secret for a week would be one thing, but this is something that has been going on for more than a month, right? It doesn't have to be a big announcement, just a private "hey, I think you should know that I'm seeing boss dude, and I know he's cool with it if you want to quit because it's awkward for you and he will give you the excellent references you need to get another job, but you're also more than welcome to stay because you are a valued employee". It doesn't have to be dramatic at all, and now it's dramatic because of the secrets.

And I totally don't think you shouldn't see boss dude, if you're into him you're into him, and you ended the other relationship, so there is nothing wrong with what's going on between the two of you. That's what I don't like about keeping those things unnecessarily secret; it creates drama where there shouldn't be drama. If your friends are so against you dating someone you like who treats you well, then they are not very good friends and you can tell them to butt out. The only thing that irks me is all of the insisting that this needs to be kept secret.. If boss dude really wanted to, he would have found a possible replacement by now. And even if you would like it to be personal, the circumstances makes it personal for your ex too, and he deserves to know.

eta: I totally agree that the note writing was totally out of line!


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