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 Post subject: Re: Had enough of body shaming?
PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 11:59 am 
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KarmaLily wrote:
That said, I have a confession to make that I'm incredibly unhappy about: I used someone's weight to put them down a couple months ago. My ex constantly joked about breaking up with me if I "ever got fat again", and when I found out this past January that he was cheating on me, I used the other's girl weight to constantly put her down to him, probably because I didn't know anything about her other than what she looked like. I still hate myself for saying those things, especially since people made fun of me all the time when I was growing up. I don't know why it didn't dawn on me at the time what I was doing when I was saying those things about her to him. I've never cared about other people's weight/body shape/looks before, and I've felt some pretty extreme guilt over this one time.

It's good to recognise when you've done something bad and to feel remorseful about it, but honestly I wouldn't beat yourself up too much about it. I think there is a difference between being unkind about someone BECAUSE of their weight and being unkind about someone's weight because of you want to be unkind to them. Obviously neither is good and I'm not saying we should all go round picking on each others faults, even when we don't mean it, just to upset them. But you were upset and it was a way of punishing her for what she did and what he did. I've called my dad's girlfriend fat before, for the sole purpose of upsetting her. She is an utter psychobitch, had said something awful to me and I was going to say something back to her, mentioning her weight was just my way of going for the jugular. It wasn't a nice thing to do, I know that, but I don't beat myself up about it.
My point, in brief, is that the fact you feel bad about it and the other things you've mentioned show that you obviously aren't fat-o-phobic or okay with body shaming. It's natural to want to verbally attack the person your boyfriend cheated on you with. So I think you should cut yourself a little slack.


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 Post subject: Re: Had enough of body shaming?
PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 12:12 pm 
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That you've confessed your words and the shame attached shows that you've learned from what happened and it's very unlikely that it will ever happen again. Your ex hurt you badly, and you reacted in a way you normally wouldn't because you were pissed off. We all say things we regret, and I agree with eryn that it doesn't mean you'll be a repeat body shaming offender since you've realized it was wrong.


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 Post subject: Re: Had enough of body shaming?
PostPosted: Thu Apr 26, 2012 9:33 am 
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eryn wrote:
KarmaLily wrote:
That said, I have a confession to make that I'm incredibly unhappy about: I used someone's weight to put them down a couple months ago. My ex constantly joked about breaking up with me if I "ever got fat again", and when I found out this past January that he was cheating on me, I used the other's girl weight to constantly put her down to him, probably because I didn't know anything about her other than what she looked like. I still hate myself for saying those things, especially since people made fun of me all the time when I was growing up. I don't know why it didn't dawn on me at the time what I was doing when I was saying those things about her to him. I've never cared about other people's weight/body shape/looks before, and I've felt some pretty extreme guilt over this one time.

It's good to recognise when you've done something bad and to feel remorseful about it, but honestly I wouldn't beat yourself up too much about it. I think there is a difference between being unkind about someone BECAUSE of their weight and being unkind about someone's weight because of you want to be unkind to them. Obviously neither is good and I'm not saying we should all go round picking on each others faults, even when we don't mean it, just to upset them. But you were upset and it was a way of punishing her for what she did and what he did. I've called my dad's girlfriend fat before, for the sole purpose of upsetting her. She is an utter psychobitch, had said something awful to me and I was going to say something back to her, mentioning her weight was just my way of going for the jugular. It wasn't a nice thing to do, I know that, but I don't beat myself up about it.
My point, in brief, is that the fact you feel bad about it and the other things you've mentioned show that you obviously aren't fat-o-phobic or okay with body shaming. It's natural to want to verbally attack the person your boyfriend cheated on you with. So I think you should cut yourself a little slack.


I agree that owning your mistake, forgiving yourself, and being clear that you won't do the same thing in the future are all good things. It sounds like KarmaLily knows it wasn't cool to do that, and wouldn't do it again. It's awesome to be able to recognize that.

I completely disagree with the idea that there's a difference between being unkind to someone because of their weight and being unkind about someone's weight just because you're mad and they're fat, though. Even mean people deserve basic human decency. Just as it wouldn't be okay to use racist or sexist or homophobic or transphobic slurs against someone just because they happen to be mean, it's just as not-okay to use fatphobia against someone if they're mean or you're mad or any other reason. It's simply not okay. If I'm mad at someone, there are plenty of ways I can express my anger without promoting fatphobia. But any time someone uses body size as a way to insult another person, no matter what the reason, it hurts everybody, not just the person you're trying to insult.

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 Post subject: Re: Had enough of body shaming?
PostPosted: Thu Apr 26, 2012 10:27 am 
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choirqueer wrote:
I completely disagree with the idea that there's a difference between being unkind to someone because of their weight and being unkind about someone's weight just because you're mad and they're fat...

I would have to respectfully disagree with this (though perhaps I wasn't quite clear with what I meant before). I would say they are most definitely very different things, I'm not saying one is in any way better than the other (though I might be inclined to say one is more understandable), I appriciate that it may feel very much the same to who you say it to regardless of your intentions and it may promote fatphobia to the same extent. My point was that it's different to the person doing the name calling; specifically that KarmaLily is not now a serial fat-shamer who holds anti-fat beliefs, just that she is a person who, as people are liable to do, made a mistake, has acknowledged that and who, as I said before, I think needs to move on from it instead of feeling so guilty.

The outcome might be the same but I think considering the intent is fairly important when you're judging and coming to terms with your own actions. Did you say something because you meant it or because you were hurt? One of those things I could forgive myself a lot more easily for and say "I've made a mistake, I've acknowledged this and I won't do it again", the other I would feel that I had some serious work to do on my beliefs and personality.


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 Post subject: Re: Had enough of body shaming?
PostPosted: Thu Apr 26, 2012 11:32 am 
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When I was in 7th grade my mother put me on a diet. I don't recall being "fat" at that time in my life. But I recall feeling hungry all the time.
Later in middle school I joined a weight loss club.
It plays havoc on a kid to be so judged so young.
My mother was anorexic all through my high school years (diagnosed) and I was large. It was a strained relationship that we are only now working out. She is often speechless when I refuse to let her comment on my kids and their weight. Because with her it is only just now health and not weight focused.

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 Post subject: Re: Had enough of body shaming?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2012 5:45 am 
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I love my body. Love it. Like, I am attracted to myself. I took off my over-clothing to get into the pool (I hate pools like I love my body) and my mom got visibly upset upon seeing my body. Stop it! Just stop! I love your body too, you silly woman! You made me, for crissakes. I felt sick to my stomach that she cared so much and felt so insecure that it was visible.

As a mom, I VOW upon pain of death that I will only ever tell my daughter that she is beautiful or that she has spinach in her teeth. Nothing worse because it would be untrue. What if something happened to her and I never got to see her again? Would I really want to have memories of worrying about what she looked like? I am responsible for her health and mental health is what I will probably have the most effect on.

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 Post subject: Re: Had enough of body shaming?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2012 9:08 pm 
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Sra. Nooch wrote:
I love my body. Love it. Like, I am attracted to myself. I took off my over-clothing to get into the pool (I hate pools like I love my body) and my mom got visibly upset upon seeing my body. Stop it! Just stop! I love your body too, you silly woman! You made me, for crissakes. I felt sick to my stomach that she cared so much and felt so insecure that it was visible.

As a mom, I VOW upon pain of death that I will only ever tell my daughter that she is beautiful or that she has spinach in her teeth. Nothing worse because it would be untrue. What if something happened to her and I never got to see her again? Would I really want to have memories of worrying about what she looked like? I am responsible for her health and mental health is what I will probably have the most effect on.


I love this.

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 Post subject: Re: Had enough of body shaming?
PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2012 2:29 am 
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Just spent an entire weekend with my serial body shaming best friend. It gets so tiring to constantly hear her judging herself, me or anyone else nearby who comes under her radar. I love her to bits but it's an ugly habit.


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 Post subject: Re: Had enough of body shaming?
PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2012 5:15 am 
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Sra. Nooch wrote:
I love my body. Love it. Like, I am attracted to myself. I took off my over-clothing to get into the pool (I hate pools like I love my body) and my mom got visibly upset upon seeing my body. Stop it! Just stop! I love your body too, you silly woman! You made me, for crissakes. I felt sick to my stomach that she cared so much and felt so insecure that it was visible.

As a mom, I VOW upon pain of death that I will only ever tell my daughter that she is beautiful or that she has spinach in her teeth. Nothing worse because it would be untrue. What if something happened to her and I never got to see her again? Would I really want to have memories of worrying about what she looked like? I am responsible for her health and mental health is what I will probably have the most effect on.


I want to hug you. So much. This is the best thing I have read in a while!


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 Post subject: Re: Had enough of body shaming?
PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2012 9:41 pm 
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ugh a good friend of mine posts on Facebook at least twice a week stuff like "ugh one thing I hate about summer: big girls in tiny clothes" and "ladies if you are over a size L please don't wear spandex! my eyes!" I want so badly just to tell her to stfu. But she won't get it, she'll just go on about how girls need to dress their size blah blah. I know part of it is she used to be a little heavy and works really hard to maintain her physique now, but that doesn't make it ok!


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 Post subject: Re: Had enough of body shaming?
PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2012 9:45 pm 
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<3 Sra. Nooch

I can't stand when my Mum does the body shaming.....calling herself fat/ugly. I remind her that we look very similar and so when she calls herself that she is inadvertently calling me that. That usually stops it but I know she still thinks this way.

I'm happy to be in a really good place body image wise. I've always felt ugly because of my right eye- when I was younger it was quite a bit larger than the other and people would comment/make fun of it all the time. I remember one girl in grade 7 who told me not to look at her because my eye was so weird.

Now it's not as big, but it's extremely cloudy- don't even think you can see a pupil. It's different- but frig its my battle scar. I've had so many surgeries and its amazing that its still in my face.

I don't know.....there's something really amazing about loving yourself/others not in spite of their "flaws" but also because of them- as they are the containers for those we care about.

ok, touchy-feely Rowan will stop now

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 Post subject: Re: Had enough of body shaming?
PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 2:05 am 
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Rowan wrote:
<3 Sra. Nooch

I can't stand when my Mum does the body shaming.....calling herself fat/ugly. I remind her that we look very similar and so when she calls herself that she is inadvertently calling me that. That usually stops it but I know she still thinks this way.

I'm happy to be in a really good place body image wise. I've always felt ugly because of my right eye- when I was younger it was quite a bit larger than the other and people would comment/make fun of it all the time. I remember one girl in grade 7 who told me not to look at her because my eye was so weird.

Now it's not as big, but it's extremely cloudy- don't even think you can see a pupil. It's different- but frig its my battle scar. I've had so many surgeries and its amazing that its still in my face.

I don't know.....there's something really amazing about loving yourself/others not in spite of their "flaws" but also because of them- as they are the containers for those we care about.

ok, touchy-feely Rowan will stop now


GRRRR to that girl who was mean to you! I got made fun of constantly as a kid because I had the thickest glasses in the whole world. Even kids who also had glasses made fun of me because mine were so huge and thick. I got contacts when I was nine because I couldn't take the teasing anymore. I had to wear glasses again for about a year after my retina surgery in 9th grade and, surprise, kids didn't get any nicer!

You are beautiful, Rowan, and anybody who can't see that has a way more serious problem with their eyesight than you or I do! <3

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 Post subject: Re: Had enough of body shaming?
PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 6:58 pm 
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The lovely Ariann posted this on FB, and it is so well put.

Media Obsession with Celeb Post-partum Bodies is Part of the War on Women

Quote:
State governments cutting funding to women’s health organizations like Planned Parenthood, the legislature that would’ve made mandatory an invasive vaginal ultrasound for women seeking abortions, Rush Limbaugh calling Sandra Fluke a slut for advocating for accessible birth control — these are all obvious moments in the War on Women, obvious attempts at oppression.

But the US Weekly article and every paparazzi photo taken of a recently-postpartumed star absolutely exist on that spectrum, as well. Scrutinizing these women, praising them for rapid weight loss, stalking them in the weeks after their babies are born (or, in the case of poor Jessica Simpson, stalking her every outing up ’til and including her arrival at the hospital this morning to give birth to daughter Maxwell), it all sends the message that a) their bodies are objects for public consumption and judgement b) that sort of weight loss is an option for every woman and c) that it’s something to aspire to. That, three weeks after having a baby, when most of us are still learning how to breastfeed, and some of us still can’t move around without assistance, we should be aspiring to weight loss.

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 Post subject: Re: Had enough of body shaming?
PostPosted: Sat May 05, 2012 12:12 pm 
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I don't weigh myself. Only when I visit the doctor. Scales are the devil.


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 Post subject: Re: Had enough of body shaming?
PostPosted: Sat May 05, 2012 12:21 pm 
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TupeloHoney wrote:
I don't weigh myself. Only when I visit the doctor. Scales are the devil.

I was at a friend's house last night and went to pee only to find a scale in the bathroom. It freaked me out and I bolted out of there.
I get that other people find them useful for a variety of reasons, but damn. If I had never had a scale in my life growing up, I would be a happier person.

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 Post subject: Re: Had enough of body shaming?
PostPosted: Sat May 05, 2012 10:30 pm 
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The only time I wish I had a scale is when I'm about to take a flight and want to check whether my luggage is above the weight limit.


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 Post subject: Re: Had enough of body shaming?
PostPosted: Sun May 06, 2012 8:32 am 
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I went to a vegan ice cream/coffee shop (Nami in downtown Phoenix) a couple weeks ago & they had a scale in their public restroom. It was right in front of the toilet, too, so you couldn't miss it. Most of the items there are high calorie pastries, coffee drinks, & dq blizzard type things called soynamis, so I would think the last thing they would want is for their customers to be thinking about their weight. My friend said "maybe one of the employees is on a diet or something & has to check her weight a lot," & I was like "maybe she should keep the scales in the break room or wait till she gets home." All the employees we saw were female is why I use she, not because only women are concerned with their weight, by the way.

Anyway, I wondered if it was a not-so-subtle way to re-enforce the stereotype that all vegans are slim & trim? Either way it made me uncomfortable (but not uncomfortable enough to stop going. Those soynamis are good!).


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 Post subject: Re: Had enough of body shaming?
PostPosted: Sun May 06, 2012 8:33 am 
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...and yes I jumped on the scale because I can't help myself when I see one (which is why I don't own one). -_-


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 Post subject: Re: Had enough of body shaming?
PostPosted: Sun May 06, 2012 8:55 am 
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Tofulish wrote:
Sra. Nooch wrote:
I love my body. Love it. Like, I am attracted to myself. I took off my over-clothing to get into the pool (I hate pools like I love my body) and my mom got visibly upset upon seeing my body. Stop it! Just stop! I love your body too, you silly woman! You made me, for crissakes. I felt sick to my stomach that she cared so much and felt so insecure that it was visible.

As a mom, I VOW upon pain of death that I will only ever tell my daughter that she is beautiful or that she has spinach in her teeth. Nothing worse because it would be untrue. What if something happened to her and I never got to see her again? Would I really want to have memories of worrying about what she looked like? I am responsible for her health and mental health is what I will probably have the most effect on.
I love this.
Me, too. Sra. Nooch, will you be my mom??

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 Post subject: Re: Had enough of body shaming?
PostPosted: Sun May 06, 2012 9:02 am 
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kallista93 wrote:
I went to a vegan ice cream/coffee shop (Nami in downtown Phoenix) a couple weeks ago & they had a scale in their public restroom. It was right in front of the toilet, too, so you couldn't miss it. Most of the items there are high calorie pastries, coffee drinks, & dq blizzard type things called soynamis, so I would think the last thing they would want is for their customers to be thinking about their weight. My friend said "maybe one of the employees is on a diet or something & has to check her weight a lot," & I was like "maybe she should keep the scales in the break room or wait till she gets home." All the employees we saw were female is why I use she, not because only women are concerned with their weight, by the way.

Anyway, I wondered if it was a not-so-subtle way to re-enforce the stereotype that all vegans are slim & trim? Either way it made me uncomfortable (but not uncomfortable enough to stop going. Those soynamis are good!).

That is wacky! I would have asked about it.


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 Post subject: Re: Had enough of body shaming?
PostPosted: Sun May 06, 2012 10:02 am 
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Rowan wrote:
I don't know.....there's something really amazing about loving yourself/others not in spite of their "flaws" but also because of them- as they are the containers for those we care about.


So true.
And also, Rowan, you are absolutely forking beautiful. Inside and out. Made more apparent by the fact that you have battle scars from struggling with your eye - that makes you strong and badass and beautiful.

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 Post subject: Re: Had enough of body shaming?
PostPosted: Sun May 06, 2012 9:07 pm 
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Thanks paprikapapaya- and I think we're all pretty forking beautiful :)

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 Post subject: Re: Had enough of body shaming?
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2012 7:54 am 
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there is some really interesting stuff in this thread. the self-hate is so pervasive everywhere for kids, not just girls but all kids. we spend a lot of time at home counteracting that. good for you Sra Nooch.

one of you lovely folks (sorry can't remember who it was) posted this on FB the other day and my kid and i sat down and watched it together. it was about doing fashion photo shoots of people with albinism, then moved to documenting children with genetic disorders in a way that allows them more dignity and acceptance than the typical "sick naked child against a clinic wall with black bars over eyes". some of it was hard to watch, and in the beginning i wondered what the photographer's real motivation was, but i think overall his aims were positive and he made some awesome photos and led us into a really good conversation.
http://www.ted.com/talks/rick_guidotti_ ... -publisher

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 Post subject: Re: Had enough of body shaming?
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2012 2:49 pm 
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torque wrote:
there is some really interesting stuff in this thread. the self-hate is so pervasive everywhere for kids, not just girls but all kids. we spend a lot of time at home counteracting that. good for you Sra Nooch.

one of you lovely folks (sorry can't remember who it was) posted this on FB the other day and my kid and i sat down and watched it together. it was about doing fashion photo shoots of people with albinism, then moved to documenting children with genetic disorders in a way that allows them more dignity and acceptance than the typical "sick naked child against a clinic wall with black bars over eyes". some of it was hard to watch, and in the beginning i wondered what the photographer's real motivation was, but i think overall his aims were positive and he made some awesome photos and led us into a really good conversation.
http://www.ted.com/talks/rick_guidotti_ ... -publisher


I don't even know where to begin - this was just awesome.


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 Post subject: Re: Had enough of body shaming?
PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2012 6:50 pm 
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Thank you for this. All of this. I am a fairly healthy person. I have had 3 children (youngest is 10 mos). Since babe #3 entered this universe, I have kept the 40 lbs that I had gained. Almost nothing fits, and I am not happy with my physical self. I have a mum who asks me if I'm pregnant if she sees me with a belly (no mum, I'm just not so thin anymore). If I look like I've lost weight, she tells me I look good. Come to think of it, I don't know when she last told me I was beautiful. She has told me that I should wear makeup so I look a bit better (I guess less tired from being a stay at home mum???).
I'm tired of pictures showing a woman who eats fruits/veggies/nuts etc. is a thin woman, and the junk food eating woman is very thick. I eat really well. I'm not thin. I have a slow metabolism/thyroid.
ANYWAYS. Thank you. This strong body gave birth to 3 fabulous, kind, intelligent and gorgeus children. They are all healthy, happy and strong. I am starting to work out again because I am feeling way too lazy (I love jogging, yoga, swimming, basically moving as much as I possibly can), and haven't done it in months..


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