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 Post subject: Re: Creationism Carpool
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 7:30 am 
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I had to ban all references to monkeys in my (English literature) classroom so that I didn't have to hear "I am not a monkey." I one time referred to the evolution of a character in a novel and students literally told me it was impossible because they didn't believe in evolution.

That is the extent to which some people don't understand evolution.

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 Post subject: Re: Creationism Carpool
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 9:07 am 
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 Post subject: Re: Creationism Carpool
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 9:14 am 
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CandyBeans wrote:
I had to ban all references to monkeys in my (English literature) classroom so that I didn't have to hear "I am not a monkey." I one time referred to the evolution of a character in a novel and students literally told me it was impossible because they didn't believe in evolution.

That is the extent to which some people don't understand evolution.


This just baffles me. It feels like such intentional ignorance.

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 Post subject: Re: Creationism Carpool
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 9:24 am 
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FootFace wrote:
B_A_D wrote:
Imitation Of Chris wrote:
Glenn Beck came out as a creationist today on his radio show. He's "never seen a half-monkey/ half-man."

Does he understand how evolution works?


Of course not. None of them do. All they know about it is the same caricature that's been peddled in right-wing circles forever.

Ok... I'm seriously lost, does the USA not have grade 5-10 science or biology classes?

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 Post subject: Re: Creationism Carpool
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 10:02 am 
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B_A_D wrote:
Ok... I'm seriously lost, does the USA not have grade 5-10 science or biology classes?


Unfortunately, science classes have no effect on the segment of society with a combination of literalist biblical beliefs and the "I don't wanna talk to a scientist/y'all mothers hubbard lying, and getting me pissed" attitude. No matter what they are taught in school, they will continually choose ignorance and have no interest in learning anything that may conflict with their interpretation of the Bible.


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 Post subject: Re: Creationism Carpool
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 12:34 pm 
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my boyfriend doesn't believe in evolution.

or aliens.

we can't even talk about it. instant argument territory.

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 Post subject: Re: Creationism Carpool
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 1:24 pm 
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Oh! And William Dembski—one of the big influential Intelligent Design guys—has recently come out as a biblical literalist:

http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2010/10/are_we_at_all_surprised.php

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 Post subject: Re: Creationism Carpool
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 2:59 pm 
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CandyBeans wrote:
I had to ban all references to monkeys in my (English literature) classroom so that I didn't have to hear "I am not a monkey." I one time referred to the evolution of a character in a novel and students literally told me it was impossible because they didn't believe in evolution.

That is the extent to which some people don't understand evolution.


Oh this makes me want to punch walls. Also: being stuck in a car with someone you disagree with on a really important issue is like my personal ninth circle of hell. I'm saving my stories for the supposed locked family thread.

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 Post subject: Re: Creationism Carpool
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 2:59 pm 
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my parents don't believe in evolution. i never really realized it, because my dad is a chemical engineer, and both my parents are university educated, and they never contradicted anything we learned in school. but then we were at a museum one day in the fossils section, looking at a replica of some kind of dinosaur and he started going on about "can you believe scientists want us to believe these things existed?" and i just walked away.

i want to know exactly what their reasoning is... i really don't see how evolution theory is completely contradictory to christian beliefs. but anyway, i'm too scared to bring it up with them. a) i'm not a scientist and not totally comfortable arguing it, and b) we have more important things to argue about, like the gays, and whether i should baptize my kids.

i don't think anyone else i know is a creationist. well, other than my parents' church friends.


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 Post subject: Re: Creationism Carpool
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 3:32 pm 
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I'm sure a couple of my coworkers are creationists. One woman who works here is constantly listening to Christian radio or Christian music.
I also kind of worry that my dad or stepmom or both might become born again some day. My dad has been way into Glenn Beck lately and also subscribed to something he calls an "e-precinct", which I take is probably a typical right wing email list from some of the things he's "learned" from it.

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 Post subject: Re: Creationism Carpool
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 7:46 pm 
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I was lucky enough to be educated at a Christian school. Ha ha?

My 8th grade science textbook had a picture of a confused cartoon bird standing next to a cartoon dinosaur hatching out of a shell. The caption said something to the effect of, "Who ever saw a bird evolve into a dinosaur? Silly evolution!"

Then, in 10th grade, I got kicked out of science class for bringing up microevolution during the teacher's spiel about how evolution was false.

We also watched videos made by Kent Hovind (or, Dr. Dino) as part of curriculum. Those of you who don't know about the hilarity that is Hovind, please google him!

I'm so glad the sane side of my family gave me books written by actual scientists instead of books written by lunatics. Pretty sure that was what kept me from growing up to attend the local Bible college and getting a BA of Bible and Ministry...

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 Post subject: Re: Creationism Carpool
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 8:33 pm 
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crowderpea wrote:
I was lucky enough to be educated at a Christian school. Ha ha?

My 8th grade science textbook had a picture of a confused cartoon bird standing next to a cartoon dinosaur hatching out of a shell. The caption said something to the effect of, "Who ever saw a bird evolve into a dinosaur? Silly evolution!"


Well, I hope they were scoffing, at least, at the idea that dinosaurs evolved into birds, because that's what paleontologists have discovered. No one thinks it happened the other way.

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 Post subject: Re: Creationism Carpool
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 8:49 pm 
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FootFace wrote:
Well, I hope they were scoffing, at least, at the idea that dinosaurs evolved into birds, because that's what paleontologists have discovered. No one thinks it happened the other way.


Honestly, I don't think it was that well thought out. They were just trying to impress you with how absurd the idea of a bird giving birth to a dinosaur was. I wish I could say there was that level of knowledge of evolution involved.

Sigh.

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 Post subject: Re: Creationism Carpool
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 9:45 pm 
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I guess I'm the wild card. Here's my comments based on what I've read so far.
At the risk of everyone judging me...

-I'm a Christian.
-I'm probably like no Christian you've ever met, and I won't speak for/represent other people who say they are Christian.
-I HATE Glenn Beck and Fox News.
-I can't stand crazy "right wing" people who yell and scream about their beliefs.
-I have a scientific mind and I like to study about evolution.
-I have a Master's Degree
-I get annoyed with "stupid christians"
-I'm a creationist and a micro-evolutionist
-I don't care about arguing about which is true. HOW I got here is less important to me than what I DO with my life.

So here I am. A tree hugging, hippie Christian who is vegan, anti war, passionate about fair trade, and a political non conformist. I love science, but I won't take the supernatural out of the equation. I think the immeasurable is just as important as the empirical.

Okay. Feel free to judge me. I can take it.

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 Post subject: Re: Creationism Carpool
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 10:16 pm 
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AutumnLeaves wrote:
I guess I'm the wild card. Here's my comments based on what I've read so far.
At the risk of everyone judging me...

-I'm a Christian.
-I'm probably like no Christian you've ever met, and I won't speak for/represent other people who say they are Christian.
-I HATE Glenn Beck and Fox News.
-I can't stand crazy "right wing" people who yell and scream about their beliefs.
-I have a scientific mind and I like to study about evolution.
-I have a Master's Degree
-I get annoyed with "stupid christians"
-I'm a creationist and a micro-evolutionist
-I don't care about arguing about which is true. HOW I got here is less important to me than what I DO with my life.


what is a micro-evolutionist?

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 Post subject: Re: Creationism Carpool
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 10:24 pm 
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They only believe in micro-evolution, but not macro evolution

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 Post subject: Re: Creationism Carpool
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 10:29 pm 
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In high school I went to an interview for this black/jewish coalition thing where we'd go do good deeds together and learn about each others cultures or something. (my mom was making me! i hated any sort of clubs!)

but anyway, i was in the interview with two other jewish kids and one of them, for some reason, decided to bring up the fact that he thought that black people were more closely related to monkeys because (he actually said this) monkeys are brown...

anyway, this guy believed in evolution, but...yeah.

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 Post subject: Re: Creationism Carpool
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 10:32 pm 
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Fee wrote:
They only believe in micro-evolution, but not macro evolution


I consider something like wolf evolving into a dog as micro, because it can happen in just a few generations.

edited to add That's the funniest thing EVER re:ijustdiedinside's post about the guy who thinks black people are more closely related to monkeys because they're brown.

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Last edited by AutumnLeaves on Fri Oct 22, 2010 10:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Creationism Carpool
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 10:36 pm 
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Microevolution is evolutionary change below the level of speciation; macroevolution is evolutionary change at or above the level of speciation. Creationists often deny that macroevolution can occur, that only microevolution--or change within species--is possible. Unfortunately, the claim is flawed for a number of reasons, not the least of which is that speciation has actually been observed numerous times.

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 Post subject: Re: Creationism Carpool
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 10:37 pm 
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It's not exactly what I believe, but a lot of people I know only believe in micro evolution. And most people I know/meet are Christians. I don't think I can consider myself that far above them since I believe in ghosts and aliens and the end of the world in 2012. But the idea of a god - that's too far.

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 Post subject: Re: Creationism Carpool
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 10:44 pm 
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I have come to two conclusions based on the sharp pain I am currently experiencing from my untreated inguinal hernia: 1) evolution occurs, and 2) if God's behind it, he forking hates me.

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 Post subject: Re: Creationism Carpool
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 10:49 pm 
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I kind of hate saying I believe in evolution. Believing is for things like ghosts and UFOs.


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 Post subject: Re: Creationism Carpool
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 10:53 pm 
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AutumnLeaves wrote:
I guess I'm the wild card. Here's my comments based on what I've read so far.
At the risk of everyone judging me...

-I'm a Christian.
-I'm probably like no Christian you've ever met, and I won't speak for/represent other people who say they are Christian.
-I HATE Glenn Beck and Fox News.
-I can't stand crazy "right wing" people who yell and scream about their beliefs.
-I have a scientific mind and I like to study about evolution.
-I have a Master's Degree
-I get annoyed with "stupid christians"
-I'm a creationist and a micro-evolutionist
-I don't care about arguing about which is true. HOW I got here is less important to me than what I DO with my life.

So here I am. A tree hugging, hippie Christian who is vegan, anti war, passionate about fair trade, and a political non conformist. I love science, but I won't take the supernatural out of the equation. I think the immeasurable is just as important as the empirical.

Okay. Feel free to judge me. I can take it.


No judgment here. While commenting on this thread, I had in mind a certain subset of fundamentalist Christians who don't want to make the effort to think for themselves or even learn anything unless it's in harmony with their literal interpretation of the Bible. I grew up in a religious family that tends to be on the conservative end of things and have run across more than my fair share of this sort of thought (or lack thereof), so it's all too easy for me to have certain knee-jerk reactions in discussions with a religious component. I also know there are fair-minded, intelligent Christians who are capable of critical thought and concerned about the world around them and how they can help make it a better place. If I did not make it clear that my comments were directed only at one particular branch of Christianity, I apologize for any offense or misunderstanding I caused, and I will be careful to make a clearer distinction in the future.


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 Post subject: Re: Creationism Carpool
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 10:53 pm 
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Maybe you haven't heard mel c, but it's just a theory

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 Post subject: Re: Creationism Carpool
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 11:17 pm 
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Fee wrote:
Maybe you haven't heard mel c, but it's just a theory

Similar to Gravity and Relativity.

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