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 Post subject: Re: "The Confidence Gap"--women in the workplace
PostPosted: Mon Mar 07, 2016 2:14 pm 
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couroupita wrote:
Someone my husband knows in the industry is interested in getting me to apply to a position at his company. I'm interested but the job doesn't sound right up my alley, so I'm not super eager. I connected with the guy and we are trying to set up a skype chat so I can find out more about the position. I'm kind of frustrated though because he only wants to talk between 7:15 am-6pm or weekends after 8 pm. I'm not trying to play hardball but this is when I'm commuting or at work (weekends are fine but he didn't tell me until 7 pm last night and I didn't see the email until today). I mentioned this to my husband that I find it annoying and he's making up all these excuses for this guy (oh, he's just trying to help you get a better job, oh he's on paternity leave and he's busy with his baby). Like, isn't he trying to recruit me? I'm secure in my job (for now), I'm not thirsty for a new position. He's an upper echelon manager--shouldn't a manager be willing to spend 30 minutes of his evening to talk to someone he's mentioned to my husband multiple times he wants to recruit? Would a woman on part time maternity leave be allowed the same excuses for not being available? I said I could talk during my lunch break. I technically have the freedom to take off time during my work day for personal errands, but I like to save those times for when it is really important. Also, doesn't it seem bad to a potentially new employer that I'd be willing to slack off work to have a casual conversation about a new job? I dunno. I want to be friendly but not a pushover and I feel really unsupported by the one person in my life who usually has good advice.


Just out of curiosity...do the guys you work with take lunch? Does anybody? When I was a manager, I was never very impressed by people who would work nonstop the whole day. You need to take breaks, for your own sanity. And what you do with those breaks, is nobody's business.


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 Post subject: Re: "The Confidence Gap"--women in the workplace
PostPosted: Mon Mar 07, 2016 2:22 pm 
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Angelina wrote:
couroupita wrote:
Someone my husband knows in the industry is interested in getting me to apply to a position at his company. I'm interested but the job doesn't sound right up my alley, so I'm not super eager. I connected with the guy and we are trying to set up a skype chat so I can find out more about the position. I'm kind of frustrated though because he only wants to talk between 7:15 am-6pm or weekends after 8 pm. I'm not trying to play hardball but this is when I'm commuting or at work (weekends are fine but he didn't tell me until 7 pm last night and I didn't see the email until today). I mentioned this to my husband that I find it annoying and he's making up all these excuses for this guy (oh, he's just trying to help you get a better job, oh he's on paternity leave and he's busy with his baby). Like, isn't he trying to recruit me? I'm secure in my job (for now), I'm not thirsty for a new position. He's an upper echelon manager--shouldn't a manager be willing to spend 30 minutes of his evening to talk to someone he's mentioned to my husband multiple times he wants to recruit? Would a woman on part time maternity leave be allowed the same excuses for not being available? I said I could talk during my lunch break. I technically have the freedom to take off time during my work day for personal errands, but I like to save those times for when it is really important. Also, doesn't it seem bad to a potentially new employer that I'd be willing to slack off work to have a casual conversation about a new job? I dunno. I want to be friendly but not a pushover and I feel really unsupported by the one person in my life who usually has good advice.


Just out of curiosity...do the guys you work with take lunch? Does anybody? When I was a manager, I was never very impressed by people who would work nonstop the whole day. You need to take breaks, for your own sanity. And what you do with those breaks, is nobody's business.

I had the same thought. Also, someone with a young child literally might not have a few minutes to do work-related things from the time they get home until the chlid goes to sleep. I think making himself available over 12 hours a day is generous, not restrictive.


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 Post subject: Re: "The Confidence Gap"--women in the workplace
PostPosted: Mon Mar 07, 2016 6:11 pm 
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I think when you have small children you are responsible for, it's really hard to focus and be able to pay attention, without a small person coming in and screaming in your ear. I think it's a good sign that he wants to be able to talk to you at a time when he can properly focus!

I'd do the interview, just to keep your skills sharp and if you get an offer, maybe you can use it to leverage the raise you've been wanting?

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 Post subject: Re: "The Confidence Gap"--women in the workplace
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 2:33 am 
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T'lish linked to a TED talk on bravery, and it resonated with me (more quotes beneath the spoiler tag): https://www.ted.com/talks/reshma_saujan ... anguage=en

Quote:
What's going on? Well, at the fifth grade level, girls routinely outperform boys in every subject, including math and science, so it's not a question of ability. The difference is in how boys and girls approach a challenge. And it doesn't just end in fifth grade. An HP report found that men will apply for a job if they meet only 60 percent of the qualifications, but women, women will apply only if they meet 100 percent of the qualifications. 100 percent. This study is usually invoked as evidence that, well, women need a little more confidence. But I think it's evidence that women have been socialized to aspire to perfection, and they're overly cautious.


Spoiler: show
Quote:
We immediately see in our program our girls' fear of not getting it right, of not being perfect. Every Girls Who Code teacher tells me the same story. During the first week, when the girls are learning how to code, a student will call her over and she'll say, "I don't know what code to write." The teacher will look at her screen, and she'll see a blank text editor. If she didn't know any better, she'd think that her student spent the past 20 minutes just staring at the screen. But if she presses undo a few times, she'll see that her student wrote code and then deleted it. She tried, she came close, but she didn't get it exactly right. Instead of showing the progress that she made, she'd rather show nothing at all. Perfection or bust.


Quote:
My friend Lev Brie, who is a professor at the University of Columbia and teaches intro to Java tells me about his office hours with computer science students. When the guys are struggling with an assignment, they'll come in and they'll say, "Professor, there's something wrong with my code." The girls will come in and say, "Professor, there's something wrong with me."

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 Post subject: Re: "The Confidence Gap"--women in the workplace
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 7:20 am 
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Semen Strong
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That article was so heartbreaking! I just hate how our society socializes girls to doubt themselves with such impossible standards of beauty/body, making them feel like they need to be perfect in the eyes of others to be acceptable, and that they don't feel safe to take risks.

I know I have suffered from all those things and I hope I can find ways to keep my child confident and happy! I love Mindy Kaling's comment that her parents raised her to be as entitled as a white man, and I know my parents tried to prepare me for disappointment at every turn, because they didn't want me to be surprised by racism or sexism.

Also, the presidential race is just underscoring for me how big the confidence gap is. The woman in the race is so well informed and prepared and would make a great president and Trump has no qualifications at all, but doesn't let it stop him. And he benefits from a presumption of competence despite his terrible track record and obvious lack of understanding or interest in being informed.

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My oven is bigger on the inside, and it produces lots of wibbly wobbly, cake wakey... stuff. - The PoopieB.

THROW A forking YAM IN THE OVEN ITS forking CHRISTMAS - LisaPunk


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