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FootFace
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Post subject: Free-range kids and related stuff Posted: Fri Dec 17, 2010 1:24 pm |
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| Grandfathered In |
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Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2010 1:41 pm Posts: 8168 Location: Seattle
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Today's free range-related outrage: A thoroughly conscientious mom is ticketed for allowing her 5-year-old to walk home from school. The blog post: Quote: A mom is ticketed for letting her 5.5 year old son walk home from school. Even though she BEGGED the school to let him take the bus. Even though she went to city council meetings and BEGGED the town to put in crossing guards. Even though she makes her son wear an ORANGE VEST AND HELMET so as to be as visible as possible along the route she taught him — the SAFEST one possible. Even though she has a younger child at home AND an older child with cerebral palsy. Nah, none of that matters, She was charged with negligence.
_________________ Did somebody say Keep on rockin?
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AmandaMelanie
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Post subject: Re: Free-range kids and related stuff Posted: Fri Dec 17, 2010 7:06 pm |
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| Wears Durian Helmet |
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Joined: Fri Oct 22, 2010 2:56 pm Posts: 842 Location: Halifax
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Why has letting your kids walk to school developed into neglect? When did it change? I started walking to school either by myself, or with my friend when I was 6. At 6 years old, we knew to go straight to and from school, not to talk or take rides from strangers, etc. We knew basic safety rules. The only kids who got a ride to school were the ones who were really late. The same elementary school I went to now has huge line ups of cars every morning and afternoon. Almost EVERY child is picked up and dropped off. One of my friends lives next door to my parents house, so her two daughters go to the school I went to. I asked her why she wouldn't let her daughters walk to school. Apparently it's because there's a short section of the walk- a path between houses and streets - that is partially wooded. She thinks child molesters and perverts might hang out in the bushes... In someones backyard?
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Aliks
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Post subject: Re: Free-range kids and related stuff Posted: Fri Dec 17, 2010 7:35 pm |
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| Top of the food chain & doesn't need to prove it |
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Joined: Tue Nov 09, 2010 4:12 pm Posts: 652
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I'd be afraid of all the crassholes texting on the road hitting my son. I have to drive him to school because we are one block too close for the bus and every week I'm almost wiped out by someone not paying attention in the lot. But I live in an area that's notorious for that.
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Tofulish
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Post subject: Re: Free-range kids and related stuff Posted: Fri Dec 17, 2010 7:56 pm |
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| Semen Strong |
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Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2010 7:10 pm Posts: 15249 Location: Cliffbar NJ
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Just to add more color, according to the comments, she has 6 children, one with cerebral palsy. The children who are in school walk together. This one instance the five year old got into an argument with brother and left school, and the mother made him take responsibility for his actions by having him walk back to school.
I just don't get it. And what happened to the van that was supposedly following the child? Why was this enough for the mother to be arrested but not to have the person in the van stopped?
Apparently there is a guy in a car near us who is following children home from school, but because the children here have learned that you don't stop and talk to strangers etc. and that you report it immediately, so far no children have been hurt. I think the key is educating children on how to handle stranger danger, not in creating some Handmaids Tale version where parents are serfs to their children. Well, any more than they already are.
_________________ But on a cold winter night, when the wind whispers through the trees and a bright, white moon hangs heavy in the air, you might hear a sad cry like someone thinking he knows what's best for you, and that'll be the white man a-passin' you by. just mumbles
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Vantine
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Post subject: Re: Free-range kids and related stuff Posted: Fri Dec 17, 2010 8:30 pm |
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| Heart of Vegan Marshmallow |
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Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 2:18 pm Posts: 3108 Location: It's hot. All the time.
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Stranger danger is not the real problem. According to the National Center for Victims of Crime:Quote: Perpetrators of child sexual abuse come from different age groups, genders, races and socio- economic backgrounds. Women sexually abuse children, although not as frequently as men, and juvenile perpetrators comprise as many as one-third of the offenders (Finkelhor, 1994). [b]One common denominator is that victims frequently know and trust their abusers.[b] The chances of the problem being a guy in a van is much smaller than the chances it's the soccer coach ...
_________________ A whole lot of access and privilege goes into being sanctimonious pricks J-Dub Dessert is currently a big bowl of sanctimonious, passive aggressive vegan enduced boak. Fezza You people are way less funny than Pandacookie. Sucks to be you.-interrobang?!
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Tofulish
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Post subject: Re: Free-range kids and related stuff Posted: Fri Dec 17, 2010 8:33 pm |
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| Semen Strong |
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Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2010 7:10 pm Posts: 15249 Location: Cliffbar NJ
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You're completely right. Thanks Vantine.
What happened to teaching your child how to handle things for themselves, while always knowing that you're there for advice and support if needed. Otherwise we're going to end up with a generation of college students who have to go everywhere in helmets and are only allowed to eat with spoons.
_________________ But on a cold winter night, when the wind whispers through the trees and a bright, white moon hangs heavy in the air, you might hear a sad cry like someone thinking he knows what's best for you, and that'll be the white man a-passin' you by. just mumbles
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FootFace
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Post subject: Re: Free-range kids and related stuff Posted: Fri Dec 17, 2010 10:36 pm |
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| Grandfathered In |
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Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2010 1:41 pm Posts: 8168 Location: Seattle
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What happened is that parents—most of us—got scared to death. Not because of statistics (crime has been on the decline for many years), but because of… Well, I'm not sure what, exactly.
Customs that were totally uncontroversial when we were young (kids walking to school and basically living their lives without constant parental supervision) have become almost completely taboo in many parts of the country. (World?)
I don't understand it, but I know I'm susceptible, too. It has become the water we all live in. It's right to be afraid for your kids, always, because—and I guess it's true in its way—something bad might happen! Something bad could always happen. You could get hit on the head by a falling airplane engine, but we don't give any credence to such fears. Likewise, something horrific could happen to your kid. It's a rarity and always has been, but we've allowed ourselves to be convinced that it's always about to happen.
The free range kids blog is really good.
_________________ Did somebody say Keep on rockin?
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Vantine
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Post subject: Re: Free-range kids and related stuff Posted: Fri Dec 17, 2010 10:52 pm |
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| Heart of Vegan Marshmallow |
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Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 2:18 pm Posts: 3108 Location: It's hot. All the time.
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FootFace wrote: What happened is that parents—most of us—got scared to death. Not because of statistics (crime has been on the decline for many years), but because of… Well, I'm not sure what, exactly.
Customs that were totally uncontroversial when we were young (kids walking to school and basically living their lives without constant parental supervision) have become almost completely taboo in many parts of the country. (World?)
I don't understand it, but I know I'm susceptible, too. It has become the water we all live in. It's right to be afraid for your kids, always, because—and I guess it's true in its way—something bad might happen! Something bad could always happen. You could get hit on the head by a falling airplane engine, but we don't give any credence to such fears. Likewise, something horrific could happen to your kid. It's a rarity and always has been, but we've allowed ourselves to be convinced that it's always about to happen.
The free range kids blog is really good. My great grandfather was killed by a falling steel beam. True story. He was a construction work though. Not too many falling pieces of steel in the library. Remember in the 70's when there was that rash of "evil children" films? That flipped to "Oh, our children are under attack!" in the 80's. Either it's Reagan's fault (Bloom County is 30 this year) or the theory I read which suggested that it was the baby boomers and their desire to not screw up their second round of kids that did it.
_________________ A whole lot of access and privilege goes into being sanctimonious pricks J-Dub Dessert is currently a big bowl of sanctimonious, passive aggressive vegan enduced boak. Fezza You people are way less funny than Pandacookie. Sucks to be you.-interrobang?!
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coldandsleepy
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Post subject: Re: Free-range kids and related stuff Posted: Fri Dec 17, 2010 10:53 pm |
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| Married to the wolfman |
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Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 9:49 pm Posts: 4906 Location: Santa Cruz, CA
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Tofulish wrote: You're completely right. Thanks Vantine.
What happened to teaching your child how to handle things for themselves, while always knowing that you're there for advice and support if needed. Otherwise we're going to end up with a generation of college students who have to go everywhere in helmets and are only allowed to eat with spoons. Quoted for truth.
_________________ "Hummus; a gentleman's vice." -- Mars
coldandsleepy cooks, THE BLOG!
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Vantine
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Post subject: Re: Free-range kids and related stuff Posted: Fri Dec 17, 2010 10:53 pm |
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| Heart of Vegan Marshmallow |
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Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 2:18 pm Posts: 3108 Location: It's hot. All the time.
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Tofulish wrote: You're completely right. Thanks Vantine.
What happened to teaching your child how to handle things for themselves, while always knowing that you're there for advice and support if needed. Otherwise we're going to end up with a generation of college students who have to go everywhere in helmets and are only allowed to eat with spoons. Um, I would check with Desdemona about that. That generation of college students is already there. Hence the phone calls from mommy that I had to field...
_________________ A whole lot of access and privilege goes into being sanctimonious pricks J-Dub Dessert is currently a big bowl of sanctimonious, passive aggressive vegan enduced boak. Fezza You people are way less funny than Pandacookie. Sucks to be you.-interrobang?!
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Vantine
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Post subject: Re: Free-range kids and related stuff Posted: Fri Dec 17, 2010 10:57 pm |
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| Heart of Vegan Marshmallow |
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Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 2:18 pm Posts: 3108 Location: It's hot. All the time.
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FootFace wrote: What happened is that parents—most of us—got scared to death. Not because of statistics (crime has been on the decline for many years), but because of… Well, I'm not sure what, exactly.
Customs that were totally uncontroversial when we were young (kids walking to school and basically living their lives without constant parental supervision) have become almost completely taboo in many parts of the country. (World?)
I don't understand it, but I know I'm susceptible, too. It has become the water we all live in. It's right to be afraid for your kids, always, because—and I guess it's true in its way—something bad might happen! Something bad could always happen. You could get hit on the head by a falling airplane engine, but we don't give any credence to such fears. Likewise, something horrific could happen to your kid. It's a rarity and always has been, but we've allowed ourselves to be convinced that it's always about to happen.
The free range kids blog is really good. Toby's dad and I argue about stuff like letting him walk the 20 feet to the public bathroom alone. This is in a bookstore where I used to work, know almost everyone there and where I am sitting near the door. He's 9 and wants to do small things that making him feel like a big boy. I asked his dad "Are you a pervert? You use that bathroom!"
_________________ A whole lot of access and privilege goes into being sanctimonious pricks J-Dub Dessert is currently a big bowl of sanctimonious, passive aggressive vegan enduced boak. Fezza You people are way less funny than Pandacookie. Sucks to be you.-interrobang?!
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FootFace
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Post subject: Re: Free-range kids and related stuff Posted: Fri Dec 17, 2010 11:36 pm |
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| Grandfathered In |
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Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2010 1:41 pm Posts: 8168 Location: Seattle
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But his position seems reasonable when that's what everyone thinks!
I am always pushing against my own implanted fears.
_________________ Did somebody say Keep on rockin?
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Vantine
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Post subject: Re: Free-range kids and related stuff Posted: Fri Dec 17, 2010 11:49 pm |
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| Heart of Vegan Marshmallow |
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Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 2:18 pm Posts: 3108 Location: It's hot. All the time.
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I don't want to raise my kid believing that there are strangers hiding everywhere, waiting to do him harm. So, I fight the urge to overprotect and let him have some freedom.
_________________ A whole lot of access and privilege goes into being sanctimonious pricks J-Dub Dessert is currently a big bowl of sanctimonious, passive aggressive vegan enduced boak. Fezza You people are way less funny than Pandacookie. Sucks to be you.-interrobang?!
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jildez
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Post subject: Re: Free-range kids and related stuff Posted: Sun Dec 19, 2010 10:59 pm |
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| Making Threats to Punks Again |
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Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 9:47 pm Posts: 1098 Location: the homestead
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Vantine wrote: I don't want to raise my kid believing that there are strangers hiding everywhere, waiting to do him harm. So, I fight the urge to overprotect and let him have some freedom. this.
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lycophyte
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Post subject: Re: Free-range kids and related stuff Posted: Mon Dec 20, 2010 10:45 am |
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| Bought A BRAND NEW CAR! |
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Joined: Thu Oct 21, 2010 1:47 pm Posts: 1651 Location: Western North Carolina
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I loved the occasional chance to walk to school when I was a kid...and this ALL happened under the age of 9, when we moved to the 'burbs and there was more bussing and lived a few too many miles to actually walk in due time (turns out its only 1.6miles to my other elementary but whatever, that pretty much doubled the time to walk it).
However, I don't remember there being a big deal about it. I guess we were walking in a group, but still! I'd walked o the park or the library alone occasionally too. And I know I at least walked in 1st grade.
Yeah, I get scared by the growth in fear of perv culture, that isn't really any worse than any other time in recent memory, and the fact that kids aren't allowed to trust their own judgments, at all.
Like, how do they build independence if they don't get to be somewhat independent!
_________________ Evolved a vascular system, so I went from bryophyte to lycophyte.
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FootFace
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Post subject: Re: Free-range kids and related stuff Posted: Mon Dec 20, 2010 1:18 pm |
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| Grandfathered In |
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Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2010 1:41 pm Posts: 8168 Location: Seattle
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Things aren't more dangerous, but we're all far more scared. That's the bottom line.
_________________ Did somebody say Keep on rockin?
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FootFace
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Post subject: Re: Free-range kids and related stuff Posted: Mon Dec 20, 2010 1:19 pm |
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Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2010 1:41 pm Posts: 8168 Location: Seattle
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_________________ Did somebody say Keep on rockin?
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FootFace
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Post subject: Re: Free-range kids and related stuff Posted: Tue Feb 08, 2011 2:10 pm |
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Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2010 1:41 pm Posts: 8168 Location: Seattle
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_________________ Did somebody say Keep on rockin?
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Fee
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Post subject: Re: Free-range kids and related stuff Posted: Tue Feb 08, 2011 2:28 pm |
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| Had sex with a vampire that sparkles. |
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Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2010 6:24 pm Posts: 4594 Location: BRLA
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I really want to hear Ann M. Martin's take on this, please.
_________________ The thing about this thread is, it's dumb. - IJDI
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Aubade
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Post subject: Re: Free-range kids and related stuff Posted: Tue Feb 08, 2011 2:34 pm |
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| Drunk Dialed Ian MacKaye |
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Joined: Sat Oct 23, 2010 8:04 am Posts: 1935 Location: nj
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I 'like' inhabitots on facebook. Last week they asked parents a question - at what age would you allow your child to ride a bike or go to the park alone. Most comments said never! I thought of this thread.
I remember riding my bike by myself all over the place when I was in grade school. It is so sad to me that society has become so scared.
_________________ I'm not asking for utopian dreams...just a little peace in this world. That's a logical thing. - Deee-Lite
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j-dub
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Post subject: Re: Free-range kids and related stuff Posted: Tue Feb 08, 2011 2:43 pm |
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| Fair trade, organic mistletoe |
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Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 12:52 am Posts: 2694 Location: Vancouver
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Fee wrote: I really want to hear Ann M. Martin's take on this, please. Ha!
_________________ "I'd rather have dried catshit! I'd rather have astroturf! I'd rather have an igloo!"~Isa
"But really, anyone willing to dangle their baby in front of a crocodile is A-OK in my book."~SSD
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monkeytoes
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Post subject: Re: Free-range kids and related stuff Posted: Tue Feb 08, 2011 4:12 pm |
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| Dead by dawn |
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Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2010 9:54 pm Posts: 6225 Location: Seattle
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Jeez, by the time I was 14, half the neighborhood had hired me to babysit their kids. I guess I lived in a neighborhood full of criminals. If a girl has a baby at 14, does she automatically get cited unless she hires a babysitter who is older than her to supervise 24/7?
_________________ facebook "The PPK: Come for the pie; stay for the croissants." - tinglepants! "Cockblocked by Richard Branson- again!" - Erika Soyf*cker
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FootFace
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Post subject: Re: Free-range kids and related stuff Posted: Tue Feb 08, 2011 5:29 pm |
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Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2010 1:41 pm Posts: 8168 Location: Seattle
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monkeytoes wrote: Jeez, by the time I was 14, half the neighborhood had hired me to babysit their kids. I guess I lived in a neighborhood full of criminals. If a girl has a baby at 14, does she automatically get cited unless she hires a babysitter who is older than her to supervise 24/7? Yes. Yes, she does.
_________________ Did somebody say Keep on rockin?
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AmandaMelanie
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Post subject: Re: Free-range kids and related stuff Posted: Tue Feb 08, 2011 6:10 pm |
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| Wears Durian Helmet |
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Joined: Fri Oct 22, 2010 2:56 pm Posts: 842 Location: Halifax
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I thought 12 was the age you're allowed to start babysitting? That's when they let us take the babysitting course at school/
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Larisa
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Post subject: Re: Free-range kids and related stuff Posted: Tue Feb 08, 2011 6:55 pm |
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| Lubes With Earth Balance |
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Joined: Thu Oct 21, 2010 1:03 pm Posts: 1654 Location: Central PA
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When I was a kid -- I don't know if it's changed since then -- you had to be 11 to take the Red Cross babysitting course. (It pretty much taught safety rules for infants and toddlers, like how you need to support a baby's head and shouldn't leave toddlers alone even for a few minutes, how to change diapers, how to decide when an emergency is something you can deal with yourself and when you need to call the police or an ambulance, and what to do if the kids' parent starts getting creepy.)
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