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matwinser
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Post subject: Gay mormon who is married to a woman Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 11:20 am |
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| Level 7 Vegan |
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Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2010 12:32 pm Posts: 1517
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Has anyone else read this: http://www.joshweed.com/2012/06/club-unicorn-in-which-i-come-out-of.htmlI was reading along, thinking it was really interesting and it seemed like he was really together and it sounded like he and his wife really, really had been honest with each other and then he said this: Quote: "I believe the doctrine of the Mormon Church is true. One of the key doctrines of the church is that “marriage between a man and a woman is ordained of God and that the family is central to the Creator’s plan for the eternal destiny of His children.” Another is that “children are entitled to birth within the bonds of matrimony, and to be reared by a father and a mother who honor marital vows with complete fidelity.” And I thought UGH! And the problem I have with it, is that it judges every other type of family, he doesn't explicitly say "I judge you" but by saying he deeply believes X the implication that Y is lesser is there. Mat.
_________________ Lady Gaga and Beyonce should run her over with the Pussy Wagon for that one comment alone - Torque (speaking of Katy Perry)
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alden
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Post subject: Re: Gay mormon who is married to a woman Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 11:31 am |
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| Top of the food chain & doesn't need to prove it |
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Joined: Mon Jul 11, 2011 1:27 am Posts: 626 Location: Southern Maryland
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I could go off on pages long rants about the LDS church, and feel fully justified in doing so since they profited off my membership for years, but I'll leave it short and simple: It's really sad that anyone would put that much trust and faith in an organization that flatly denies their right to be who they know they are.
_________________ Imma let you finish, but the Paranthropus Boisei were the greatest vegans ever.
Ugh I saw all these cave paintings complaining about vegan cheese options. I don't miss those days. -Isa
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flavabean
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Post subject: Re: Gay mormon who is married to a woman Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 11:49 am |
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| Bathes in Braggs |
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Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 7:48 pm Posts: 1329
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This makes me really, really sad.
I really hope he's happy. I hope he's being honest with himself and has the wisdom and strength to separate his beliefs/needs from what the church is telling him he believes and needs. No relationship is perfect, and I never want to judge, but this makes me so sad. And when it involves a family... I hope he's being true to himself.
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solipsistnation
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Post subject: Re: Gay mormon who is married to a woman Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 12:11 pm |
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| Fat Morrissey |
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Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 5:58 pm Posts: 3817 Location: Santa Cruz, CAAAAAAAAAAA
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Yeh, I've been reading Dan Savage's commentary on this-- his main issue is that if there's one open gay guy married to a woman (happily, he claims), then he will become the poster-child for not allowing same-sex marriage at all. Hey, if THAT GUY can be happy married to a lady, so you can you, ya homo! Get with a chick already and get over it!
_________________ "Trolling an internet message board, The Greatest Activism Of All." - pandacookie Вы такие сексапильные, когда злитесь
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Ruby Rose
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Post subject: Re: Gay mormon who is married to a woman Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 1:40 pm |
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| Brain Made of Raw Seitan |
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Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 1:31 pm Posts: 1211 Location: In the land of Druids and Moonrakers
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The odds are certainly stacked against them for that marriage working out long term.
_________________ Jammy pieces for all! - interrobang?! Who ATE MY DRIED POOP BAR?! - Guilty of Being Sprite We are here to discuss the gender politics of cats, not your mommy issues. - Expired Sanity
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mumbles
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Post subject: Re: Gay mormon who is married to a woman Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 3:14 pm |
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| rowdily playing checkers |
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Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2010 2:53 pm Posts: 2667
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"You might be having an emotional reaction of some kind to this post. We want you to know that that’s okay."
Fuck you.
_________________ "Tits are inconsequential, but someone pass me that kitten" ~ papayapaprikás
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b.vicious
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Post subject: Re: Gay mormon who is married to a woman Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 3:20 pm |
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| ugh |
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Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 1:20 pm Posts: 2453 Location: north of Boston, MA, USA
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Quote: Being gay does not mean you are a sinner or that you are evil. Sin is in action, not in temptation or attraction. I feel this is a very important distinction. This is true for every single person. You don’t get to choose your circumstances, but you do get to choose what you do with them. Don't worry gay folks, being gay is fine, you just can't be in a gay relationship having gay sex. Or, well, you can, but you'll be sinning. But everybody sins, so I'm not really judging you! But sins are immoral acts. *brainsplode*
_________________
"I feel like it's not a real political discussion if I'm not morally opposed to something I don't understand." - ndpittman
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Chipmunk
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Post subject: Re: Gay mormon who is married to a woman Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 5:11 pm |
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| Should Write a Goddam Book Already |
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Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 2:00 pm Posts: 1079 Location: Sweden
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I got to about here before my eyes started rolling uncontrollably Quote: I won’t get into the boring details of the research here, but basically when sex is done right, at its deepest level it is about intimacy. It is about one human being connecting with another human being they love. It is a beautiful physical manifestation of two people being connected in a truly vulnerable, intimate manner because they love each other profoundly. It is bodies connecting and souls connecting. It is beautiful and rich and fulfilling and spiritual and amazing. Many people never get to this point in their sex lives because it requires incredible communication, trust, vulnerability, and connection. Oh, there's a correct way to "do" sex?
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pandacookie
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Post subject: Re: Gay mormon who is married to a woman Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 5:22 pm |
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| Just Loathin' Around! |
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Joined: Fri Oct 22, 2010 8:17 pm Posts: 5821 Location: bindlestiff
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hee hee.
_________________ Damn straight I am not ok with potential baby poop on Tutankhamun or Dani Marti's exhibitions. ---M. Bang
Panda With Cookie
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solipsistnation
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Post subject: Re: Gay mormon who is married to a woman Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 5:25 pm |
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| Fat Morrissey |
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Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 5:58 pm Posts: 3817 Location: Santa Cruz, CAAAAAAAAAAA
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Dan Savage: http://slog.thestranger.com/slog/archiv ... t-explodesQuote: (...)"free to be you and me" is not the lesson anti-gay religious conservatives are going to draw from Josh Weed's case. They will hold Weed up as proof that there's no need for marriage equality or domestic partnerships or civil unions—no need to recognize same-sex couples under the law at all—because all gay people everywhere should follow Josh Weed's example. Society should encourage each of us to find an opposite-sex partner who is willing to marry us and who we can either fork successfully while thinking about gay sex or whom we feel so strongly about that we 1. actually enjoy forking or 2. will claim we enjoy forking in blog posts that our opposite-sex partners help us write. Unicorn Marriages—Weed describes himself as a unicorn—will be pushed as Plan B for gays and lesbians who flunk out of ex-gay ministries.
_________________ "Trolling an internet message board, The Greatest Activism Of All." - pandacookie Вы такие сексапильные, когда злитесь
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solipsistnation
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Post subject: Re: Gay mormon who is married to a woman Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 5:27 pm |
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| Fat Morrissey |
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Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 5:58 pm Posts: 3817 Location: Santa Cruz, CAAAAAAAAAAA
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Chipmunk wrote: I got to about here before my eyes started rolling uncontrollably Quote: I won’t get into the boring details of the research here, but basically when sex is done right, at its deepest level it is about intimacy. It is about one human being connecting with another human being they love. It is a beautiful physical manifestation of two people being connected in a truly vulnerable, intimate manner because they love each other profoundly. It is bodies connecting and souls connecting. It is beautiful and rich and fulfilling and spiritual and amazing. Many people never get to this point in their sex lives because it requires incredible communication, trust, vulnerability, and connection. Oh, there's a correct way to "do" sex? http://slog.thestranger.com/slog/archives/2012/06/11/by-josh-weeds-logicQuote: Basically any straight guy who wants a sex life that's as rich and fulfilling and amazing and spiritual and connected as the Gay Josh enjoys with Straight Lolly... should marry a gay dude. It's the only way to avoid powerful chems and infatuation and obsession and the rest of that actually-physically-attracted-to-your-spouse shiitake that, according to Josh, has wound up ruining the sex lives of most of the straight people that he personally knows.
You want a great sex life, straight boys? Take Josh's advice: find yourself a nice fag, someone you can connect with on a deeper level, and marry him.
_________________ "Trolling an internet message board, The Greatest Activism Of All." - pandacookie Вы такие сексапильные, когда злитесь
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interrobang?!
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Post subject: Re: Gay mormon who is married to a woman Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 6:10 pm |
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| Mediocre Tart |
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Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 2:55 pm Posts: 4161 Location: Burnistoun
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just mumbles wrote: fork you. I have a list of favourite mumbles' quotes. This one shoots right to the top of the hit parade.
_________________ "I will take a drugged, sex-crazed, punk rock commie over Mrs. Thatch any day of the week" - Vantine "You are no fun, Vantine." - Invictus "I am doing dishes with a bleeding hand, I don't have time to be nice to you!" - SJK
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Vantine
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Post subject: Re: Gay mormon who is married to a woman Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 6:26 pm |
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| Angrily Posting on Facebook |
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Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 2:18 pm Posts: 3108 Location: It's hot. All the time.
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interrobang?! wrote: just mumbles wrote: fork you. I have a list of favourite mumbles' quotes. This one shoots right to the top of the hit parade. We should dump talking about hdog and talk about Mumbles instead. I'll see you on FB in 4 minutes.
_________________ A whole lot of access and privilege goes into being sanctimonious pricks J-Dub Dessert is currently a big bowl of sanctimonious, passive aggressive vegan enduced boak. Fezza You people are way less funny than Pandacookie. Sucks to be you.-interrobang?!
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interrobang?!
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Post subject: Re: Gay mormon who is married to a woman Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 6:41 pm |
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| Mediocre Tart |
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Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 2:55 pm Posts: 4161 Location: Burnistoun
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Vantine wrote: interrobang?! wrote: just mumbles wrote: fork you. I have a list of favourite mumbles' quotes. This one shoots right to the top of the hit parade. We should dump talking about hdog and talk about Mumbles instead. I'll see you on FB in 4 minutes. I don't believe we have talked of hdog in months. You talk up his part, everso. Also, I am ASLEEP.
_________________ "I will take a drugged, sex-crazed, punk rock commie over Mrs. Thatch any day of the week" - Vantine "You are no fun, Vantine." - Invictus "I am doing dishes with a bleeding hand, I don't have time to be nice to you!" - SJK
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Vantine
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Post subject: Re: Gay mormon who is married to a woman Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 6:50 pm |
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| Angrily Posting on Facebook |
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Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 2:18 pm Posts: 3108 Location: It's hot. All the time.
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Quote: I am sexually attracted to men. I am not sexually attracted to women. It is very simple. I have many, many years of experience which confirm this to be true, but it’s really as simple as what a girl asked me* in junior high—and I’m sorry if this is a little blunt, but I’ve never found a question that cuts to the heart of the matter more effectively— “so, if everyone in this room took off their clothes, would you be turned on by the girls or the guys?” My answer, which I didn’t say out loud, was unquestionably the guys. And it was unquestionably not the girls. He contradicts himself ... a lot. If he's not attracted to women, he's not attracted to his wife. He may have found a way to have sex with her but he's not really sexually attracted to her.
_________________ A whole lot of access and privilege goes into being sanctimonious pricks J-Dub Dessert is currently a big bowl of sanctimonious, passive aggressive vegan enduced boak. Fezza You people are way less funny than Pandacookie. Sucks to be you.-interrobang?!
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Vantine
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Post subject: Re: Gay mormon who is married to a woman Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 6:55 pm |
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| Angrily Posting on Facebook |
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Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 2:18 pm Posts: 3108 Location: It's hot. All the time.
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I'm trying to let this go but...he needs to stop saying that he feels "compassion" for those poor gay people. Also, fork him for suggesting that the only real family is one composed of children and their biological parents. I presume that adoptive parents are also artificial?
_________________ A whole lot of access and privilege goes into being sanctimonious pricks J-Dub Dessert is currently a big bowl of sanctimonious, passive aggressive vegan enduced boak. Fezza You people are way less funny than Pandacookie. Sucks to be you.-interrobang?!
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Vantine
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Post subject: Re: Gay mormon who is married to a woman Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 6:58 pm |
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| Angrily Posting on Facebook |
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Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 2:18 pm Posts: 3108 Location: It's hot. All the time.
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Ruby Rose wrote: The odds are certainly stacked against them for that marriage working out long term. As long as they are sincere members of the Mormon faith, they will stay married. I think that is a big motivating force for him.
_________________ A whole lot of access and privilege goes into being sanctimonious pricks J-Dub Dessert is currently a big bowl of sanctimonious, passive aggressive vegan enduced boak. Fezza You people are way less funny than Pandacookie. Sucks to be you.-interrobang?!
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chaioli
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Post subject: Re: Gay mormon who is married to a woman Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 7:46 pm |
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| Banned from Vegan Freaks. |
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Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 4:03 pm Posts: 340 Location: SF Bay Area
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Why did the woman marry him? Wouldn't she want to have married a straight man who was actually attracted to her not just to make proper, god-ordained babies and be in a proper, god-ordained family?
If I were that woman, I would feel like I was being used just to help make this guy feel like he wasn't a sinner. That's not cool.
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kimba
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Post subject: Re: Gay mormon who is married to a woman Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 9:25 pm |
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| Drunk Dialed Ian MacKaye |
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Joined: Wed Jan 05, 2011 7:44 pm Posts: 1920
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I don't see this as a big deal. It sounds like he is a gay man in love with and attracted to a woman. I'm not a fan of the sin talk, but I don't think hisbeing gay is dooming his relationship. It's not like he has to fit in a particular box just because he is gay.
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dakini
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Post subject: Re: Gay mormon who is married to a woman Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 9:43 pm |
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| Spent a night at the Bates Motel |
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Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2010 8:31 pm Posts: 1819 Location: detroit, mi
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I'm having a hard time wrapping my brain around this. I keep trying, and then getting annoyed.
_________________ I'm still buddhist & I still love cupcakes. My etsy shop! http://lunasapawthecary.etsy.com
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Larisa
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Post subject: Re: Gay mormon who is married to a woman Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 10:05 pm |
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| Wrote Dissertation on Vegans, Meat, and the Deserted Island Question |
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Joined: Thu Oct 21, 2010 1:03 pm Posts: 1654 Location: Central PA
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chaioli wrote: Why did the woman marry him? Wouldn't she want to have married a straight man who was actually attracted to her not just to make proper, god-ordained babies and be in a proper, god-ordained family?
If I were that woman, I would feel like I was being used just to help make this guy feel like he wasn't a sinner. That's not cool. Well, she married him knowing that he was gay. He'd told her when they were 16. So it's not like he surprised her with this after they were already married.
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tinglepants!
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Post subject: Re: Gay mormon who is married to a woman Posted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 11:32 am |
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| Chip Strong |
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Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 6:08 pm Posts: 998 Location: Notavandownbytheriver
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kimba wrote: I don't see this as a big deal. It sounds like he is a gay man in love with and attracted to a woman. I'm not a fan of the sin talk, but I don't think hisbeing gay is dooming his relationship. It's not like he has to fit in a particular box just because he is gay. Had he simply said that he loves his wife and family, and was happy and didn't need to start a new relationship, then that wouldn't be a big deal. The problem with this is that by invoking the Mormon Church's beliefs as a reason for him to stay in the marriage, he's implicitly stating that it is immoral to engage in a same-sex relationship. Not only does he show his hand at denial (love isn't the only reason he's staying with his wife), but he's passing judgment on anyone who decides to not sacrifice their own happiness and well-being by repressing their sexuality. He may say in those final paragraphs that it is absolutely wrong to judge, but he already has. And doing so doesn't isn't innocuous--it can elicit some seriously damaging consequences for others who are already afraid to live as themselves.
_________________ "So often I wish Adam were a real boy." - interrobang?! "If he was you'd hear him farting at the back of your yoga class." - 8ball
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j-dub
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Post subject: Re: Gay mormon who is married to a woman Posted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 4:42 pm |
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| Fair trade, organic mistletoe |
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Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 12:52 am Posts: 2697 Location: Vancouver
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I don't know...is it shitty? For sure. But...he's a religious gay dude who can't even begin to live honestly because his religion (and culture at large) is homophobic. I just feel sorry for him. It sounds like he's tried to reconcile his sexuality and his faith and has found a way that (for now at least) works.
As to the idea that homophobes will use this as justification for inequality, maybe. But their arguments don't actually stand on reason. They stand on outright bigotry. They don't need to point to this guy and say "see, gayz?! Marry a woman!", because all of their arguments stand on the "EWWW GAY" principle which is as far from reason and logic as possible. Homophobes are gonna be homophobes regardless of whether this guy sleeps with men or his wife.
_________________ "I'd rather have dried catshit! I'd rather have astroturf! I'd rather have an igloo!"~Isa
"But really, anyone willing to dangle their baby in front of a crocodile is A-OK in my book."~SSD
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kimba
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Post subject: Re: Gay mormon who is married to a woman Posted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 7:35 pm |
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| Drunk Dialed Ian MacKaye |
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Joined: Wed Jan 05, 2011 7:44 pm Posts: 1920
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j-dub wrote: Homophobes are gonna be homophobes regardless of whether this guy sleeps with men or his wife. That is pretty much what I was thinking.
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tinglepants!
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Post subject: Re: Gay mormon who is married to a woman Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 12:02 am |
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| Chip Strong |
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Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 6:08 pm Posts: 998 Location: Notavandownbytheriver
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j-dub wrote: I don't know...is it shitty? For sure. But...he's a religious gay dude who can't even begin to live honestly because his religion (and culture at large) is homophobic. I just feel sorry for him. It sounds like he's tried to reconcile his sexuality and his faith and has found a way that (for now at least) works.
As to the idea that homophobes will use this as justification for inequality, maybe. But their arguments don't actually stand on reason. They stand on outright bigotry. They don't need to point to this guy and say "see, gayz?! Marry a woman!", because all of their arguments stand on the "EWWW GAY" principle which is as far from reason and logic as possible. Homophobes are gonna be homophobes regardless of whether this guy sleeps with men or his wife. But what about the readers who are, like himself, religious and gay and maybe don't want to make the same choice he's made? This is an article that's had a large readership--and it wasn't even published that long ago. I agree that he's not going to further strengthen homophobes--they do that for themselves. But I do think it's a realistic concern that this could discourage some readers from being true to themselves.
_________________ "So often I wish Adam were a real boy." - interrobang?! "If he was you'd hear him farting at the back of your yoga class." - 8ball
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