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 Post subject: Brendan Brazier, Norris, Calcium, B12 And Misinformation
PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2012 9:40 am 
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From the blog of Jack Norris, vegan Registered Dietitian(RD) and cofounder of Vegan Outreach:


http://jacknorrisrd.com/?p=3037

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An activist brought to my attention the article B12 Deficiencies in Vegans? Not True! at Flaming Vegan. I guess I’m naive about what vegans are saying about vitamin B12, but I was very surprised to read the article and the comments, and so I posted a response below it. It’s mostly about seaweed as a source of vitamin B12.

Another reader brought my attention to a page on vegan triathlete Brendan Brazier’s site, Lesson 2: [url=Lesson 2: High Net-Gain Nutrition]High Net-Gain Nutrition[/url]. On that page, he claims that miso is a source of vitamin B12. In fact, the two studies that have measured vitamin B12 in miso have found none.

Brazier also claims that chlorella is “the best source of B-12!” Two studies have found vitamin B12 analogues in batches of chlorella while one study found practically none. This could mean that the B12 analogues in the two studies that found it were there from contamination, which means it cannot be relied upon. More importantly, Chlorella has not been tested to see if it improves vitamin B12 status in humans. The track record of other seaweeds that were once considered a source of B12 has not been good, so there is reason to be skeptical of chlorella as well. Thus, chlorella is far from the best source of vitamin B12.

Citations for the miso and chlorella studies can be found in B12 in Tempeh, Seaweeds, Organic Produce, and Other Plant Foods.

As an aside, Brazier lists romaine lettuce and arugula as sources of calcium. According to the USDA, one cup of shredded romaine has only 15 mg of calcium, making it a poor source. One cup of arugula has 32 mg of calcium, making it a somewhat better source, but still not very good.

I sent Mr. Brazier a note through his contact form on May 5 in an attempt to alert him to these issues and did not get a response. As of today, this information is still on his website so I thought it was appropriate to let readers know they should not rely on this information and continue my attempt to spread the word to the vegan community about reliable sources of vitamin B12.


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 Post subject: Re: Brendan Brazier, Norris, Calcium, B12 And Misinformation
PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2012 10:14 am 
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Apparently I am also naive, because i'm always surprised when people are like, "Vegans don't need supplements! Eat food instead! P.S. I get my B-12 by eating nutritional yeast." I guess I became vegan in the right environment?

Also every time someone says something false about B12, I remember to pop a tablet.

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 Post subject: Re: Brendan Brazier, Norris, Calcium, B12 And Misinformation
PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2012 10:48 am 
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mrsbadmouth wrote:
Apparently I am also naive, because i'm always surprised when people are like, "Vegans don't need supplements! Eat food instead! P.S. I get my B-12 by eating nutritional yeast." I guess I became vegan in the right environment?

Also every time someone says something false about B12, I remember to pop a tablet.


I started going veg when I was 14. I swallowed every bit of industry marketing and every bit of nutrition folklore hook, line, and sinker.

Next life, I am doing it your way. LOL!

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 Post subject: Re: Brendan Brazier, Norris, Calcium, B12 And Misinformation
PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2012 11:30 am 
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Brazier is really into food-based supplements. I'm guessing a lot of his personal results with them are due to the Placebo effect. Aside from the misinformation on B12, I don't remember any cautionary notes either. After reading one of his books, I added chlorella to my smoothies a few times. Then one day I got the worst case of stomach "flu" I've had since salmonella in my pre-veg days. The vomiting only lasted a couple of days, but I felt sick for weeks. When I started back on smoothies a couple weeks later, repeat poisoning. It may have just been a bad batch/brand I used, but I've heard quite a few people have had bad experiences with chlorella.

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 Post subject: Re: Brendan Brazier, Norris, Calcium, B12 And Misinformation
PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2012 2:52 pm 
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I always thought arugula was a much better source of calcium than broccoli, which is often listed as calium rich. Per 100g arugula has 160mg and broccoli only about 50mg. (according to nutritiondata.com).


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 Post subject: Re: Brendan Brazier, Norris, Calcium, B12 And Misinformation
PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2012 3:02 pm 
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Not that this is really the point, but it'd be a lot harder to eat 100g of arugula then 100g of broccoli. 100 grams of broccoli is about a cup raw and 100g of arugula is about 5 cups (also according to nutritiondata)

I think the point jack norris was making is that telling people they can get all calcium they need from raw greens is misleading.

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 Post subject: Re: Brendan Brazier, Norris, Calcium, B12 And Misinformation
PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2012 3:19 pm 
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You are right. But here in Germany we have no other reference than grams. A package of arugula has 125g and personally I don't find it that hard to eat. And I don't even eat that much salad. Most of the nutritional info I get comes from the US because ther is more research on vegan nutrition. But since I grew up with the metric system this is my reference point. It is interesting how that sometimes changes my view about what counts as a good source. I'd always choose arugula over broccoli because I never think in cups.


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 Post subject: Re: Brendan Brazier, Norris, Calcium, B12 And Misinformation
PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2012 4:14 pm 
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ijustdiedinside wrote:
Not that this is really the point, but it'd be a lot harder to eat 100g of arugula then 100g of broccoli. 100 grams of broccoli is about a cup raw and 100g of arugula is about 5 cups (also according to nutritiondata)


+ 1

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 Post subject: Re: Brendan Brazier, Norris, Calcium, B12 And Misinformation
PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2012 5:36 pm 
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Jack Norris is nicer than I am. I read the article he linked to and dismissed it when I saw that the author wrote an article promoting juice fasts and believes that there is a conspiracy to keep the B12 content in veg and fruit a secret so some mysterious cabal of doctors, researchers, and food manufacturers can profit from supplements.
The comments about "pure vegan nutrition" and how a raw food diet will cure all ills made me a little sick to my stomach. And then, after Jack Norris posts his corrections to her steaming pile of boak she writes:
Quote:
And I would definitely do my part of the research as well before amending anything. I've only too often read that B12 deficiencies in vegans aren't as bad as everyone thinks because we don't get the same amount as meat-eaters, but since the types we get are absorbed more easily, we get an important amount. So please do not ask me to modify my article as I don't have either the time to do the research nor the power to change this article.


Her source for her article? Natural news (dot) com. Awesome.

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 Post subject: Re: Brendan Brazier, Norris, Calcium, B12 And Misinformation
PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2012 6:05 pm 
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That is pretty hilarious. Don't ask her to change her article because she doesn't have the time to do the research!

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 Post subject: Re: Brendan Brazier, Norris, Calcium, B12 And Misinformation
PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2012 12:06 pm 
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Vantine wrote:
Jack Norris is nicer than I am. I read the article he linked to and dismissed it when I saw that the author wrote an article promoting juice fasts and believes that there is a conspiracy to keep the B12 content in veg and fruit a secret so some mysterious cabal of doctors, researchers, and food manufacturers can profit from supplements.


Years ago I got kicked off of a European forum for a combination of posting links about the NAVs vegfest and links to what Jack Norris had to say about why vegans should supplement with vitamin b-12.

The owner of the forum thought that posting about a vegan event on a vegan forum was trolling. He also thought, like the woman you mentioned above, that there is a money making conspiracy among health professionals to get vegans to buy b-12 supplements.

Pointing out that I spent about $30 a year on b-12 supplements...or about 8 cents a day didn't change his mind about there being a conspiracy to profit off of b-12 supplements.

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 Post subject: Re: Brendan Brazier, Norris, Calcium, B12 And Misinformation
PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2012 12:13 pm 
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Looks like somebody pulled a Monkeyboner! More like Dudley Do-Wrong! Somebody needs to go back to School Ties!

...

The Mummy!

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 Post subject: Re: Brendan Brazier, Norris, Calcium, B12 And Misinformation
PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2012 12:14 pm 
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I'm going to pretend you saw this thread yesterday and spent a full 24 hours planning that comment.

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 Post subject: Re: Brendan Brazier, Norris, Calcium, B12 And Misinformation
PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2012 12:16 pm 
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Yes.

Pretend.

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 Post subject: Re: Brendan Brazier, Norris, Calcium, B12 And Misinformation
PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2012 12:49 pm 
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Why is mumbles pulling a monkey's boner?

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 Post subject: Re: Brendan Brazier, Norris, Calcium, B12 And Misinformation
PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2012 2:13 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Brendan Brazier, Norris, Calcium, B12 And Misinformation
PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2012 2:20 pm 
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beforewisdom wrote:
Vantine wrote:
Jack Norris is nicer than I am. I read the article he linked to and dismissed it when I saw that the author wrote an article promoting juice fasts and believes that there is a conspiracy to keep the B12 content in veg and fruit a secret so some mysterious cabal of doctors, researchers, and food manufacturers can profit from supplements.


Years ago I got kicked off of a European forum for a combination of posting links about the NAVs vegfest and links to what Jack Norris had to say about why vegans should supplement with vitamin b-12.

The owner of the forum thought that posting about a vegan event on a vegan forum was trolling. He also thought, like the woman you mentioned above, that there is a money making conspiracy among health professionals to get vegans to buy b-12 supplements.

Pointing out that I spent about $30 a year on b-12 supplements...or about 8 cents a day didn't change his mind about there being a conspiracy to profit off of b-12 supplements.


Korn!


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 Post subject: Re: Brendan Brazier, Norris, Calcium, B12 And Misinformation
PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2012 3:26 pm 
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I mentioned no names!

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 Post subject: Re: Brendan Brazier, Norris, Calcium, B12 And Misinformation
PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2012 3:35 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Brendan Brazier, Norris, Calcium, B12 And Misinformation
PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2012 3:47 pm 
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*cough* *cough*

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