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 Post subject: Distance runners: do your long training runs wipe you out?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 14, 2010 5:52 pm 
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Huffs Nutritional Yeast

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I'm training for my first marathon (Disney on Jan.9th) and am now getting into some seriously LONG runs. Today was 18 miles. I've done a few half marathons and that is a good comfortable race distance for me, but these longer runs - really these days anything much longer than 10 - completely wipes me out for the rest of the day! Does anyone else experience this? I'm pretty healthy as far as I know, I eat like a horse, and I do carry a package of Clif Bloks for longer runs. Today I also took a couple of gels which are a couple hundred calories each and I think I may feel marginally better.

Am I not fueling enough during the run, need to increase protein/carb intake, or should I expect to feel like shiitake until (hopefully) my body adapts? I think the excitement of race day will carry me through, but in the meantime I have three 20 milers to complete and it's a little discouraging to think I'll be completely useless for the rest of the day. Any thoughts?


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 Post subject: Re: Distance runners: do your long training runs wipe you ou
PostPosted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 9:03 am 
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Bathes in Braggs
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I would be interested in answers to this as well.

I have not run farther than about 25 k (15 miles), done a couple of half-marathons, but I am reluctant to try full marathons because people I know who have trained for them have said the long runs wipe them out. I can't afford to lose a full day from family time / cleaning / cooking every week when I work full-time.

I find that half-marathon distance is easy. When I am running a lot, doing a long run on Sunday, I can run 20-22 k in the morning and then proceed with my day (after a meal and a bit of rest) with no problem.


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 Post subject: Re: Distance runners: do your long training runs wipe you ou
PostPosted: Tue Nov 16, 2010 9:36 pm 
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I think that your endurance and recovery improves with each long run. Certainly you can feel tired, but I don't feel so tired that I can't do anything else. After my run, I eat a big lunch and maybe have a rest and read for an hour or so. Make sure you eat a good meal the night before as well. Elsa1028, you wrote that you eat some shot bloks during run (I eat fig newtons, dates on 20 milers), but you didn't mention breakfast. If you aren't eating b'fast, try to eat a couple hundred calories if you can (bagel, cereal, etc). i bet you'll notice some improvements with some long runs under your belt. takes some time for your body to absorb/adapt.


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 Post subject: Re: Distance runners: do your long training runs wipe you ou
PostPosted: Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:43 am 
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Huffs Nutritional Yeast

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Thanks, kecapcrazy!
I have something really tiny (small handful of nuts) before a run as I'm out the door at 6 or 7am and only when I think of it. I will definitely try eating beforehand because I do notice I'm much improved after a couple of meals on those days. Maybe my dinky little package of shot bloks might not do for these longer runs - the date/fig newton idea sounds great! I'll post back after a few days about this.


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 Post subject: Re: Distance runners: do your long training runs wipe you ou
PostPosted: Wed Nov 17, 2010 12:28 pm 
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elsa1028 wrote:
Thanks, kecapcrazy!
I have something really tiny (small handful of nuts) before a run as I'm out the door at 6 or 7am and only when I think of it. I will definitely try eating beforehand because I do notice I'm much improved after a couple of meals on those days. Maybe my dinky little package of shot bloks might not do for these longer runs - the date/fig newton idea sounds great! I'll post back after a few days about this.


i dont know as much about running and i know everyone is different but a handful of nuts might not be the best fuel before a run since they are high in fat/protein and are hard to digest.

i am also a fan of eating dates compared to shot blocks/gu's

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 Post subject: Re: Distance runners: do your long training runs wipe you ou
PostPosted: Wed Nov 17, 2010 1:19 pm 
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My marathon runner friend recommended that I eat white bread products before a long run. He does half a white (not wheat!) english muffin with peanut butter - that way he gets the instant jolt from the carbs and the more sustained energy from the protein. I hurt my leg before I got to try it myself, but it makes sense in theory.


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 Post subject: Re: Distance runners: do your long training runs wipe you ou
PostPosted: Wed Nov 17, 2010 2:06 pm 
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I usually do the same as molly's friend. A piece of toast with almond or peanut butter. Whole wheat might be okay but it depends on how your digestion is generally on a run. I know I have to do white bread and avoid too much fiber if I don't want part of my long run to be a desperate sprint to a toilet.

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 Post subject: Re: Distance runners: do your long training runs wipe you ou
PostPosted: Thu Nov 18, 2010 5:30 am 
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Huffs Nutritional Yeast

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Thanks, everyone!
I have a 10 miler on Saturday and a 20 miler on Sunday, so I'll get to try these ideas out this weekend. Yeah, just eating nuts probably won't cut it anymore!
It's funny how I've forgotten the basics (eating!) as I train for this marathon. I've been distracted by fitting in these longer runs and an ankle problem and generally just hoping I'll finish!


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 Post subject: Re: Distance runners: do your long training runs wipe you ou
PostPosted: Sun Nov 21, 2010 8:14 am 
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elsa1028 wrote:
Thanks, everyone!
I have a 10 miler on Saturday and a 20 miler on Sunday, so I'll get to try these ideas out this weekend. Yeah, just eating nuts probably won't cut it anymore!
It's funny how I've forgotten the basics (eating!) as I train for this marathon. I've been distracted by fitting in these longer runs and an ankle problem and generally just hoping I'll finish!

Good luck with your run today (and I hope your run yesterday went well!)
Remember PPK believes in you!


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 Post subject: Re: Distance runners: do your long training runs wipe you ou
PostPosted: Sun Nov 21, 2010 4:53 pm 
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I like to drink a smoothie with vanilla soy yogurt, frozen bananas, and frozen berries before a run in the morning. It seems to have the right balance of carbs & protein for me. When I trained for a half marathon last year, the last 2 training runs over 10 miles left me tired... and very hungry. I was eating cereal and milk before those runs, and I think the dairy did not agree with me. I'm much more confident about my nutrition this year.

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 Post subject: Re: Distance runners: do your long training runs wipe you ou
PostPosted: Mon Nov 22, 2010 5:53 am 
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Huffs Nutritional Yeast

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Ok - 10 miles on Saturday, 20 on Sunday, and thanks to all of the good advice I felt a bit more human after yesterday's run! I had french toast for breakfast, a small snack of peanut butter crackers right before the run and did a couple of gu's and a pack of shot bloks during. While tired, I definitely didn't bonk during the run and didn't experience the brain fog I had after previous long runs. But I definitely need to get me some fig newtons, too!
So thanks, PPKers! I appreciate your help! :)


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 Post subject: Re: Distance runners: do your long training runs wipe you ou
PostPosted: Sat Dec 18, 2010 5:53 pm 
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This book has a LOT of info on nutrition and recipes and stuff - http://www.amazon.com/Thrive-Nutrition- ... 776&sr=8-1 - he does triathalons

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 Post subject: Re: Distance runners: do your long training runs wipe you ou
PostPosted: Sun Dec 19, 2010 1:57 pm 
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Tofu Pup

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I'm pretty late on this post since you're probably tapering now, but you should be taking in about 100 calories every 45 minutes during your long run and your race in January. I would also suggest taking electrolyte tablets during you long runs to help replace what you lose through sweat. I've noticed a big difference during my runs once I started taking them. Hammer Nutrition makes vegan electrolyte pills: http://www.hammernutrition.com/products/endurolytes.elt.html?navcat=fuels-energy-drinks

Good luck @ Disney!


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 Post subject: Re: Distance runners: do your long training runs wipe you ou
PostPosted: Tue Dec 21, 2010 10:34 pm 
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Thinks Plants Have Feelings
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danes726 wrote:
I'm pretty late on this post since you're probably tapering now, but you should be taking in about 100 calories every 45 minutes during your long run and your race in January. I would also suggest taking electrolyte tablets during you long runs to help replace what you lose through sweat. I've noticed a big difference during my runs once I started taking them. Hammer Nutrition makes vegan electrolyte pills: http://www.hammernutrition.com/products/endurolytes.elt.html?navcat=fuels-energy-drinks

Good luck @ Disney!


I've got to try this.
I'm only doing 9-mile "long runs" so far, (feel like such a wimp compared to you marathon-trainers) but as I am new to them I find my body goes kinda kerflooey afterward. Even though I eat a bagel for breakfast and solid carby meals the day before. This past Sunday I got home, had lunch, passed out on the couch and did not feel normal again until lunch the next day.
I've had the same thing happen to me in the past with long bike rides (like 40-50 milers and longer). Perhaps it's time to look into supplements and bring some Clif shots on my long runs.


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 Post subject: Re: Distance runners: do your long training runs wipe you ou
PostPosted: Sun Dec 26, 2010 5:31 am 
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Huffs Nutritional Yeast

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Thanks for the advice, danes726! I will check into those electrolyte tablets. Coincidentally, I was talking to someone who was raving about their gels or drinks - not sore if those are vegan, but sounds like this company does some good stuff.

Last long-ish run today, if I can get it in before the blizzard! Two weeks to go and I'm getting psyched!


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 Post subject: Re: Distance runners: do your long training runs wipe you ou
PostPosted: Mon Dec 27, 2010 1:34 pm 
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monkeygirl wrote:
I've got to try this.
I'm only doing 9-mile "long runs" so far, (feel like such a wimp compared to you marathon-trainers) but as I am new to them I find my body goes kinda kerflooey afterward. Even though I eat a bagel for breakfast and solid carby meals the day before. This past Sunday I got home, had lunch, passed out on the couch and did not feel normal again until lunch the next day.
I've had the same thing happen to me in the past with long bike rides (like 40-50 milers and longer). Perhaps it's time to look into supplements and bring some Clif shots on my long runs.


I always have a gel about 30 minutes prior to my long run (or you could have a banana; just 100 cals of basic carbohydrates), and I always bring gels (or blocks, if that's more your thing) for anything that will last more than an hour, and make sure to have a gel every 45 minutes with water (to avoid gut rot).

Also, I usually end up doing my marathon training in the summer, so maybe this is less of an issue for winter runners, but I would also do ice baths after really long runs - fill the bathtub with cool water, add a bag or two of ice. You can wear a sweatshirt if you like to keep your upper body warm, but be sure to submerge your hips/knees/ankles. Helped a LOT. Also, you only submerge yourself for a minute or two to avoid hypothermia.

Finally... you may be going too fast. The long runs are supposed to be a slow run at least a minute under your race pace, I think. You might try running 15 or 30 seconds slower to see if that helps at all. To make it a bit more tolerable mentally, you could try to do negative splits on your long runs (which is apparently how those crazy Kenyans train).

Only ideas, of course - hope it helps!


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 Post subject: Re: Distance runners: do your long training runs wipe you ou
PostPosted: Mon Dec 27, 2010 1:36 pm 
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elsa1028 wrote:
Thanks for the advice, danes726! I will check into those electrolyte tablets. Coincidentally, I was talking to someone who was raving about their gels or drinks - not sore if those are vegan, but sounds like this company does some good stuff.

Last long-ish run today, if I can get it in before the blizzard! Two weeks to go and I'm getting psyched!


Woohooo!! Good luck - you'll have a blast! Tell us how it goes!!


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 Post subject: Re: Distance runners: do your long training runs wipe you ou
PostPosted: Mon Dec 27, 2010 10:41 pm 
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So, I bought electrolyte tablets (the fizzy ones you dissolve in water) and also gels. (Most of the gels are vegan, as far as I can tell, mine are Clif shots).
Anyhoo, I had half a tablet in water before my long run, another half in a small water bottle I brought along and ate one gel shot while on the run.
I felt dramatically better afterward than I did last week. No significant wiped-outness. And I ran further.
So yes, probably this is the way to go.


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 Post subject: Re: Distance runners: do your long training runs wipe you ou
PostPosted: Tue Dec 28, 2010 9:37 am 
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monkeygirl wrote:
So, I bought electrolyte tablets (the fizzy ones you dissolve in water) and also gels. (Most of the gels are vegan, as far as I can tell, mine are Clif shots).
Anyhoo, I had half a tablet in water before my long run, another half in a small water bottle I brought along and ate one gel shot while on the run.
I felt dramatically better afterward than I did last week. No significant wiped-outness. And I ran further.
So yes, probably this is the way to go.


NICE! Isn't it awesome when you don't have to guess anymore? Hooray! I'm so glad you found something that works!


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 Post subject: Re: Distance runners: do your long training runs wipe you ou
PostPosted: Sat Jan 15, 2011 2:14 pm 
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Huffs Nutritional Yeast

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Just back from Disney! The marathon was AWESOME and incredibly, I felt great the whole time. The weather was perfect, and the entertainment and crowds really carried me through. At mile 20 I actually thought, "I have another 6.2 in me!" and finished with a big doofusy grin on my face! Finished the day with an awesome vegan feast at 1900 Park Fare - see my post in the Food Porn section under "Walt Disney World Food Porn" for the details.

dandykins: I did a cool water bath after the race, and it did really help with recovery. Thanks!

Thanks, all, for the words of encouragement and all the great advice!


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 Post subject: Re: Distance runners: do your long training runs wipe you ou
PostPosted: Sun Jan 16, 2011 12:34 pm 
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That's fabulous, Elsa! Got any pictures of that big doofusy grin?


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 Post subject: Re: Distance runners: do your long training runs wipe you ou
PostPosted: Sun Jan 16, 2011 2:55 pm 
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Congratulations, Elsa! Way to go! I'm so excited it was a good experience. Some of my DailyMile friends ran the same race and said it was a great event - well-supported, good crowds, etc. Well done!!


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 Post subject: Re: Distance runners: do your long training runs wipe you ou
PostPosted: Mon Jan 17, 2011 6:58 am 
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Huffs Nutritional Yeast

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Arisaig wrote:
That's fabulous, Elsa! Got any pictures of that big doofusy grin?

Bottom right hand corner - not the best shot, but that's all we have till official photos come out.
Image
All done - woo hoo!
Image


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 Post subject: Re: Distance runners: do your long training runs wipe you ou
PostPosted: Mon Jan 17, 2011 10:04 am 
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SO awesome. What mile was the first picture? You looked like you were having a blast! Congratulations again, Elsa!!


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 Post subject: Re: Distance runners: do your long training runs wipe you ou
PostPosted: Mon Jan 17, 2011 2:53 pm 
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Huffs Nutritional Yeast

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dandykins wrote:
SO awesome. What mile was the first picture? You looked like you were having a blast! Congratulations again, Elsa!!

Thanks, dandykins! That would be right in the home stretch - mile 26! My husband was yelling to me from the crowd to get a picture and I was so psyched to see him, and to almost be done!


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