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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 8:30 pm 
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Desdemona wrote:
My freshmen are currently writing a visual analysis, and this photo came up in our conversation about iconic images. I've also been looking at lots of WWII stuff lately while gathering material for my MoFo theme, so my partner posted this on my FB wall. Interesting/disturbing, innit?

http://cratesandribbons.com/2012/09/30/the-kissing-sailor-or-the-selective-blindness-of-rape-culture-vj-day-times-square/

Oh, I've always hated that picture! I've ALWAYS thought it looked so awkward - the headlock, the woman's clenched fist, the fact she wasn't embracing him, even the small bit of her face you can see, it looks like she is recoiling.


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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2012 4:10 pm 
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I've never expected guys to pay for my dinner, movie tickets, or any of that stuff. Of course it's nice when someone takes care of the bill, especially if they're more financially stable than I am, but I just don't feel right having someone justify spending money on our date because they're a dude and I'm a lady.

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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 3:10 pm 
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This douche:

Quote:
State Rep. Roger Rivard (R-Rice Lake) spoke to the Chetek Alert newspaper in December about a 17-year-old who was charged with assault after having sex with his underage girlfriend on their high school campus. According to the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel, Rivard said his father had warned him that "some girls rape easy." He explained that meant they'd verbally consent to sex, then later accuse the man of rape.

"If it's rape, it's rape," Rivard told the newspaper. "If it's not, it's not."

Rivard, who was endorsed by Rep. Paul Ryan (R-Wis.) in August, told the Journal Sentinel Wednesday that his father's advice was taken out of context:

"He also told me one thing, 'If you do (have premarital sex), just remember, consensual sex can turn into rape in an awful hurry,'" Rivard said. "Because all of a sudden a young lady gets pregnant and the parents are madder than a wet hen and she's not going to say, 'Oh, yeah, I was part of the program.' All that she has to say or the parents have to say is it was rape because she's underage. And he just said, 'Remember, Roger, if you go down that road, some girls,' he said, 'they rape so easy.'

"What the whole genesis of it was, it was advice to me, telling me, 'If you're going to go down that road, you may have consensual sex that night and then the next morning it may be rape.' So the way he said it was, 'Just remember, Roger, some girls, they rape so easy. It may be rape the next morning.'

"So it's been kind of taken out of context."


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/10/10/roger-rivard-rape_n_1956491.html


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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 3:48 pm 
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This site is pretty eye-opening and rage inducing:

http://www.everydaysexism.com/


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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 9:16 am 
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Thanks 8ball, it was really illuminating and definitely rage-inducing. It made me remember so many little things that had indeed happened but I always dismissed as "not a big deal". Compared to the awful things that go on in some places I can definitely say I didn't have to deal with major sexism, but that doesn't mean I should be ignoring the stuff that does go on as if it was normal.

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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Sun Oct 14, 2012 9:47 am 
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Some frightening Tea Party lady said:

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Our country might have been better off if it was still just men voting. There is nothing worse than a bunch of mean, hateful women. They are diabolical in how than can skewer a person.


http://www.examiner.com/article/mississ ... al-to-vote

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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Sun Oct 14, 2012 12:34 pm 
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The main commentator at the Ironman Kona race yesterday. Nine out of every ten times that he referred to the females racing, he called them "girls." For chrissake, dude, most of the pro women are 30+ and they are phenomenal, highly accomplished, awe inspiring athletes racing for a world title. If you wouldn't dream of using the word "boys" to commentate the men's race, don't use the word "girls" to refer these women.

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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Sun Oct 14, 2012 7:49 pm 
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The amount of sexism and slutshaming being tossed around about Amanda Todd.

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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Sun Oct 14, 2012 8:04 pm 
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DrakeRedcrest wrote:
The amount of sexism and slutshaming being tossed around about Amanda Todd.


This! There are so many forked up things I'm seeing about her on facebook. People saying she deserved to die because she was a slut. What is wrong with people? And then when you say something against it, suddenly you're "missing the joke" or "butt hurt" because it's the internet and apparently it's cool to be a complete crasshole.


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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 4:47 am 
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What the fork is wrong with people? I just googled and read about Amanda Todd and holy shiitake those people are awful.

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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 2:10 pm 
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I was thinking about how as women, we are expected to just shake off harassment with no consequences.

A man pulled up next to me, honked so I'd look and then made licking faces at me and Leela. He then proceeded to drive alongside our car so that I had to pull off the road to feel safe. He was in his employers truck, so I called them and was told that he will be dealt with, but I have to wonder (1) how much privilege it takes for this guy to do that to random women and (2) how do you explain to a child that they live in world where that is ok and that as women and girls they have to be prepared for it? Urgh.

I am still shaking with anger.

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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 2:34 pm 
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Tofulish wrote:
I was thinking about how as women, we are expected to just shake off harassment with no consequences.

A man pulled up next to me, honked so I'd look and then made licking faces at me and Leela. He then proceeded to drive alongside our car so that I had to pull off the road to feel safe. He was in his employers truck, so I called them and was told that he will be dealt with, but I have to wonder (1) how much privilege it takes for this guy to do that to random women and (2) how do you explain to a child that they live in world where that is ok and that as women and girls they have to be prepared for it? Urgh.

I am still shaking with anger.


Hope my empathy would be any confort... I wonder if there was indeed something wrong in our education as girls (at least, mine): like, beeing told to accept harassment - "yeah, boys are just annoying", "let them do", "pretend you don't hear them", "pretend you don't see them"...

fork, no, it's NOT normal.

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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 2:52 pm 
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Emilie wrote:
I wonder if there was indeed something wrong in our education as girls (at least, mine): like, beeing told to accept harassment - "yeah, boys are just annoying", "let them do", "pretend you don't hear them", "pretend you don't see them"...

fork, no, it's NOT normal.


Yes, that! I don't need comfort, but it was so interesting to look at my own feelings. My first sense was "what the fizzle, I am a middle aged woman, in a hummus-stained turtleneck in broad daylight, with a baby in the back of my Toyota, this shouldn't be happening to me." As in, I don't deserve it, because I'm not doing anything "wrong." But it wouldn't be okay even if I were a 20 year old in the middle of the night with a box of condoms in the back of her Ferrari.

Then I went through "am I over-reacting? should I call his employer and complain? Am I risking retaliation?"

Women are trained to second-guess themselves so much. And that second-guessing involves taking on the male gaze to try and evaluate whether you *have the right* to be upset.

My friend who is a social worker talks about street harassment as the "gateway drug" to domestic violence because it teaches men that women can be treated like objects and that your desires trump hers.

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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 2:56 pm 
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Tofulish wrote:
But it wouldn't be okay even if I were a 20 year old in the middle of the night with a box of condoms in the back of her Ferrari.


totally! and that's something we have to repeat again and again -to ourselves and to everyone

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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 1:58 pm 
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sit down and report
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Bring-ba ... 4087706736

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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 1:22 am 
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Tofulish wrote:
(2) how do you explain to a child that they live in world where that is ok and that as women and girls they have to be prepared for it? Urgh.


I am definitely not going to explain that to my daughter. I hope she spits those idiots in the eye as soon as she's old enough.


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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 10:09 am 
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I am raising up three kids.. a boy and two girls.
From a young age you do the best you can to treat them the way you want the world to be.
I have called out friends for treating their girls in a way that teaches girls boys get what they want even after the girl has said no.
It will always be a battle. But it will always be worth it.

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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 12:55 pm 
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8ball wrote:
This site is pretty eye-opening and rage inducing:

http://www.everydaysexism.com/


I really like this. Thanks for posting it.

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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 6:55 pm 
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Ugh where to start?
I had a group of "friends" who used to tell me I wasnt living by the bible's gender roles. I needed to be submissive to my husband (I told him that and he thought I was kidding), I had to love cleaning my house and being a stay at home mom (I dont love it everyday, sue me). I worked until I went into labor with my 1st child (I was a chef) and I wanted to go back but daycare was insanely expensive and my husband made a lot more then I did. Since then Ive had 2 more kids and I really dont mind staying home but Id like to go back to work when they are all in school. When we lost our fourth child at 18 weeks due to a medically needed surgery they told me I murdered my child. I feel sick still even writing that. I cut them all off right then and wondered why Id ever been friends with them in the first place and I realized it was because they were mothers also. No other reason. I want to smack myself for ever speaking to people like that. I never really had any issues until motherhood. College, work, marriage were all fine. After reading almost all the replies though I see so much that I never noticed and I will be much more aware of now.


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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 6:57 pm 
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BareFootKate wrote:
Ugh where to start?
I had a group of "friends" who used to tell me I wasnt living by the bible's gender roles. I needed to be submissive to my husband (I told him that and he thought I was kidding), I had to love cleaning my house and being a stay at home mom (I dont love it everyday, sue me). I worked until I went into labor with my 1st child (I was a chef) and I wanted to go back but daycare was insanely expensive and my husband made a lot more then I did. Since then Ive had 2 more kids and I really dont mind staying home but Id like to go back to work when they are all in school. When we lost our fourth child at 18 weeks due to a medically needed surgery they told me I murdered my child. I feel sick still even writing that. I cut them all off right then and wondered why Id ever been friends with them in the first place and I realized it was because they were mothers also. No other reason. I want to smack myself for ever speaking to people like that. I never really had any issues until motherhood. College, work, marriage were all fine. After reading almost all the replies though I see so much that I never noticed and I will be much more aware of now.

That sucks BFK! Since probably not a lot of other people have said it, I'm very sorry for your loss. If you need surgery, you need surgery, and that's nobody else's business.

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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 7:01 pm 
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Jigglypuff wrote:
BareFootKate wrote:
Ugh where to start?
I had a group of "friends" who used to tell me I wasnt living by the bible's gender roles. I needed to be submissive to my husband (I told him that and he thought I was kidding), I had to love cleaning my house and being a stay at home mom (I dont love it everyday, sue me). I worked until I went into labor with my 1st child (I was a chef) and I wanted to go back but daycare was insanely expensive and my husband made a lot more then I did. Since then Ive had 2 more kids and I really dont mind staying home but Id like to go back to work when they are all in school. When we lost our fourth child at 18 weeks due to a medically needed surgery they told me I murdered my child. I feel sick still even writing that. I cut them all off right then and wondered why Id ever been friends with them in the first place and I realized it was because they were mothers also. No other reason. I want to smack myself for ever speaking to people like that. I never really had any issues until motherhood. College, work, marriage were all fine. After reading almost all the replies though I see so much that I never noticed and I will be much more aware of now.

That sucks BFK! Since probably not a lot of other people have said it, I'm very sorry for your loss. If you need surgery, you need surgery, and that's nobody else's business.


Thank you, I really thought friends would support me. I felt awful making that choice even if it was needed. I still cry. One of them in particular was the worst and she told me through my tears that I was going to hell for sure.


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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 7:20 pm 
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BareFootKate, I'm sorry you had that experience. It's awful when people you trust turn out to be terrible.

In a similar vein, a friend - or so I thought - accused me of believing all men are rapists. He said that he is insulted by that "fact." He also said that it is "just as difficult being a man as it is being a girl" (emphasis mine). I can't even.

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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 6:12 am 
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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 9:30 am 
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I was flipping the radio stations this morning and a particular station splits their time and apparently for some part of the day, they have conservative talk radio. This morning I heard just before I kept going (paraphrased) "when did we start letting women vote? why?" then they went to talk about some Obama 'lies'. I didn't hear the previous comment that prompted the women voting thing but at first I thought it was a historical question but then realized it was a rhetorical one indicating women shouldn't vote.

The interesting thing is that in our household, I am the one that researches what I think 'we' should vote. My husband is his own person but I tell him what I'm voting for, discuss the options and let him know reasons to vote for this or that. He generally votes for whatever I vote for.

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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 9:34 am 
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I tended to do a lot more research at the start of our relationship, but now we both really like Rachel Maddow, JStew and Colbert, so we discuss stuff and then pretty much always vote the same way.

I just think that anyone who wants to disenfranchise women, minorities, the poor etc is just admitting that they aren't really interested in representative government.

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