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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2012 9:48 pm 
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j-dub wrote:
starrynight87 wrote:
On the radio this morning, the topic of discussion was "is it acceptable for a woman to not shave her legs during the winter?" I was just like, really? Have you run out of things to talk about?

The other day we had "Do women need to get breast implants every twenty years?"

uh, ok, that one is worse.

A radio station I used to listen to when I was a teenager had a regular segment on its evening show called the "Hot Girl Check In." The douches would have girls call in, and whenever a girl would call in to complain that they were objectifying women, they'd say, "oh, she's probably only objecting because she's ugly." Even then that pissed me off.


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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2012 10:00 pm 
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starrynight87 wrote:
On the radio this morning, the topic of discussion was "is it acceptable for a woman to not shave her legs during the winter?" I was just like, really? Have you run out of things to talk about?


what did they decide? i need to know if i should go get some more razors!

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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2012 10:42 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2012 11:08 pm 
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Fact: Every April, I use dog clippers on my legs. It takes a VERY long time, but I can't make anything else work on the glorious splendour of my winter coat.

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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2012 11:14 pm 
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DrakeRedcrest wrote:
Fact: Every April, I use dog clippers on my legs. It takes a VERY long time, but I can't make anything else work on the glorious splendour of my winter coat.


You are my favourite person because of your candor

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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 9:11 am 
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I just had the displeasure of being on a quiz team with a complete and utter tosser. He was a friend of a friend of a friend and as soon as I sat down I got a bad feeling about him. Highlights of the evening included him talking about sex and trying to get us to talk about sex within 5 minutes of meeting him, over the top praise whenever anyone female got something right, constantly bringing up how young we were in a totally creepy way (me and my friend are in our early 20s, he must've been late 50s). The cherry on top was when he said bye, a peck on the cheek would've been inappropriate but I wouldn't have been that bothered, he went for a very gentle, sexually overtoned kiss on my ear, which was completely vile and I now want to scrub my bloody ear off.

I honestly can't believe men like him exist, I spent half the evening wanting to laugh at how seriously he took himself. He thought he was a proper ladies man, really charming and intelligent.


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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 10:39 am 
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Fee wrote:
Really unfunny, uncool rape joke that you say is pretty uncool and unfunny and then, THEN a bunch of dudebros explain it to you like...oh no, sorry you didn't understand, but it's actually a joke so it's FUNNY. Because if someone means something to be funny and unoffensive, it actually is.

I hate that. This guy I work with occasionally makes jokes about girls with bulimia, and the moment I tell him it is not okay and not funny, he rolls his eyes or just walks away. Or says I'm too sensitive. It is really forking frustrating because he is otherwise totally respectful, but for some reason he thinks that women with bulimia deserve to be the butt of his jokes.


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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 10:41 am 
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I don't know if this is a fat thing or a woman thing but here goes:
For most of my life, I have participated in some sort of sports or at least been pretty active. I also tend to be chubby. Over the years, my weight has fluctuated a lot, although I have never been what most people consider skinny. After 31 years, I feel like I finally have a good, healthy grip on this, and understand that my body does pretty forking well by me, even with extra padding.
Anyhow, I started running (jogging?) about 2 months ago, and I will admit I am pretty slow. Also, my asparagus jiggles. Somehow, this inspires people to yell uplifting encouragement at me. I know that doesn't sound like the worst thing in the world, but the same people don't say anything to faster runners or slower men. I tend to be pretty competitive, so if people where cheering me on because I was faster, I might eat it up.
But to me, it feels like people are making a snap judgement about me because I am a heavier woman. Like they assume I've made some sort of "brave choice"to get my jiggly asparagus off the couch and exercise. And that their encouragement is welcome or helpful.
I know this probably sounds like a dumb thing to be upset by, or like I'm looking for things to be offended by. Really, i'm not. I just don't want strangers to comment on my body, ever.


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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 10:44 am 
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Olives wrote:
I just don't want strangers to comment on my body, ever.

Amen.


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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 10:45 am 
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Oh and the aforementioned coworker also told me that he doesn't like to be friends with women he is not attracted to.


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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 11:14 am 
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Olives wrote:
I don't know if this is a fat thing or a woman thing but here goes:
For most of my life, I have participated in some sort of sports or at least been pretty active. I also tend to be chubby. Over the years, my weight has fluctuated a lot, although I have never been what most people consider skinny. After 31 years, I feel like I finally have a good, healthy grip on this, and understand that my body does pretty forking well by me, even with extra padding.
Anyhow, I started running (jogging?) about 2 months ago, and I will admit I am pretty slow. Also, my asparagus jiggles. Somehow, this inspires people to yell uplifting encouragement at me. I know that doesn't sound like the worst thing in the world, but the same people don't say anything to faster runners or slower men. I tend to be pretty competitive, so if people where cheering me on because I was faster, I might eat it up.
But to me, it feels like people are making a snap judgement about me because I am a heavier woman. Like they assume I've made some sort of "brave choice"to get my jiggly asparagus off the couch and exercise. And that their encouragement is welcome or helpful.
I know this probably sounds like a dumb thing to be upset by, or like I'm looking for things to be offended by. Really, i'm not. I just don't want strangers to comment on my body, ever.


Thank you for this! I find myself regressing into that kind of thing in my mind-so I'll mentally congratulate someone for going for a run (I don't say it outloud) because I have some body image issues I sometimes accidentally think of myself as 'out of shape' just because I'm heavier. I'm not. I may be slow, but I have massive calves of doom that are awesome and strong and the only reason they're that size is because I bike everywhere and they're huge muscles under the skin!

(basically, thanks for calling my brain on its BS)

edited to fix punctuation. Also, i'm not sure I'm making much sense.

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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 6:50 pm 
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My boyfriend, today. We were chatting and the topic of our area of work came up and he is a staunch believer that hard work gets you whatever you deserve. Which...you know, yes. But no. There is so much deep seated stigma for minorities, women, etc. that people aren't even aware of as you all know. And he uses this example of a woman he used to work with (who I used to work with- and I know how hard it is for her in her job and how much sexism she's got ingrained in her beliefs).
Which even got brought up later in the conversation. He said, "It's not up to me to change the world. [The status quo] works and there's nothing wrong with following it."
I was astounded, but I'm proud of my response: "It isn't about being the leader of the revolution. It's about being a kind person to the people around you. It's about doing what is good, and that cascades into revolution eventually. You don't have to spearhead it, but you do have the responsibility to be a kind, understanding, good human being to those around you."

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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 10:40 pm 
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That's an awesome response, Missdelaney. You should be proud of yourself. I know I would have just angrily sputtered on the spot and would have been completely ineffective, but that was so well put.


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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 11:20 pm 
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Aw, missdelaney, it's so hard to hear that sort of thing from someone close to you. What a great way to respond.


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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 11:23 pm 
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Now this is compounded by getting this posted on my facebook:

"Aside from the fact that the writer sounds like he/she does this as a part time segues from his/her primary role as a writer for "The Daily Show," I didn't learn something new and enlightening from this article. Folks are mad because white men have ruled the world for so long and now it's slipping. Understand that's as bad a thing as it is good. One race, age, sexual, or ethnic group recedes from dominance and it will be replaced. Absolute power corrupts absolutely. Sorry if I don't think the world can be better or work in harmony to the benefit of everyone. It can't. Humans are too selfish. Irony?"

(it was in response to this article: http://jezebel.com/5965429/oh-god-pleas ... l-movement)

My feelings are actually incredibly hurt by this. Ugh.

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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 8:54 am 
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vijita wrote:
Oh and the aforementioned coworker also told me that he doesn't like to be friends with women he is not attracted to.


I've heard this from guys before, specifically a male friend. It more or less ended my feelings that the speaker was my friend at all.

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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 10:54 am 
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Yesterday I was crawling underneath the dishwasher, trying to fix it, and he was just standing behind me watching and laughing. I ended up fixing it! But he got a whole show out of it and that peas me off.

I'm really struggling with this coworker because on some levels we are great friends, but when he starts leering and saying creepy things about me and my female coworkers, I want to throw a hammer at him. (Literally...yesterday I had a hammer that I wanted to throw).


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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 12:35 pm 
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Tofulish wrote:
I kind of want to smack people who are all like "OMG I AM SO FAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAT!" Why do we have to bond by all agreeing that our bodies aren't what they want them to be.

I really want to respond by saying "OMG MY VAGINA DOESN'T SHOOT FIRE!"
Image


Mine does!

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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 5:37 am 
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I've been challenging my own feminism lately.

I've grown up with a fascination with serial killers, as in what made them into killers, how on earth they function in society (at least on the surface) and the lack of empathy in their actions. The majority of them kill women exclusively. I'm by no means wanting to glamourize them or what they do and refuse to call any of them my 'favourite' as I revile the pain they cause, but I'm having trouble reconciling my feminism with my fascination.


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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 7:48 am 
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I have started playing roller derby some months ago. Yesterday, we practiced falling and we posed for a group shot that someone posted to our leagues Facebook with the text 'Proud of our fresh meat who have practiced their falling today', or something along those lines. And what's the first thing someone says in reaction to that picture? A bloke saying: "When's the nude calendar 2013 coming out?" To which one of my fellow fresh meat answered: "Might be a good idea for sponsoring!"

Image

1) The fact that "Ooh, I'd like to see them naked" is someone's first thought upon seeing that picture. It's a super cool picture of twelve women in sports gear, happily smiling with the excitement of doing rockstar falls and barrel rolls. It's not sexy, it hasn't got anything to do with sex or nudity and by commenting on our bodies and possible nudity, this bloke is bypassing everything that picture IS actually about: team spirit, athleticism, excitement about the practice, the league being proud of us, whatever.

2) My fellow fresh meat who think it's a good idea to employ our bodies in a sexy/erotic way to gain something for our league. (This remark about the nude calendar wasn't the first and won't be the last. We've had discussions about sexy car washes, showing cleavage to male managers of prospective new training locations etc.) Thank the Lard that the women in charge of our league are firmly on my side and are very much against using sex/nudity for profit so none of this will actually happen for real, but it hurts me that my fellow fresh meat see this as a legitimate way to get ahead as a league.

Roller derby is a team sport for women, organized by women and played in leagues run by women. Then why does it boil down to being physically attractive/sexy, nudity and catering for the male gaze once again?

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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 10:02 am 
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The lady in the gif looks like my GP.

I think I understand lack of conscience and how people lacking it operate. But, I'm not fascinated by such people. If anything, I pity them for their lack of moral guidance which makes functioning in the society difficult, but I do try to stay away from them and think everybody else should, too. Our safety first.


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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 10:17 pm 
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What the fork did I just read? This dude from the Terrible Men Project would rather keep raping people than stop partying. Trigger warning.
http://goodmenproject.com/featured-cont ... /#comments

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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 11:30 pm 
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Jigglypuff wrote:
What the fork did I just read? This dude from the Terrible Men Project would rather keep raping people than stop partying. Trigger warning.
http://goodmenproject.com/featured-cont ... /#comments

I'm not going to read that cause...yikes! But I will say I stay far, far away from the Good Men Project. It is awful and runs entirely counter to its title.

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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 11:37 pm 
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j-dub wrote:
I will say I stay far, far away from the Good Men Project. It is awful and runs entirely counter to its title.


I find that interesting, and would appreciate your thoughts on that. I've read two pieces that I thought were good and thought-provoking, even though its not something I read normally. One piece was talking about how the little girl Princess culture is a tool of the patrimony with Dads looking to put their emotional weight and needs on their daughters, whose love is much less complicated and less conditional than that of their wives, which I thought was great, but can't find again. And the other was talking about how men need to stand up and call out other men who rape or otherwise hurt women.

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 Post subject: Re: Who challenges your feminism in your life?
PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2012 12:12 am 
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Tofulish wrote:
j-dub wrote:
I will say I stay far, far away from the Good Men Project. It is awful and runs entirely counter to its title.


I find that interesting, and would appreciate your thoughts on that. I've read two pieces that I thought were good and thought-provoking, even though its not something I read normally. One piece was talking about how the little girl Princess culture is a tool of the patrimony with Dads looking to put their emotional weight and needs on their daughters, whose love is much less complicated and less conditional than that of their wives, which I thought was great, but can't find again. And the other was talking about how men need to stand up and call out other men who rape or otherwise hurt women.

Here is a pretty good starting point. And if attempted-murderer, sexual assaulter, sleeps with his students Hugo Schwyzer is calling you out, you know your shiitake is bad. (And because the preceding comment will certainly raise eyebrows, here's a great summary of why it's forked up for Schwyzer to be heralded as a feminist).

I've also read a few pieces on there in the last year or so that made my skin crawl. It seems like things have changed substantially from when the site began.

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