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 Post subject: Re: Pope Benedict is a big, fat quitter!
PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 5:37 pm 
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I can't think of a single period in time where the C C worked towards social justice. I am not being contrarian (and anti-theist here), I am drawing a blank.
And do NOT mention Mother Teresa.


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 Post subject: Re: Pope Benedict is a big, fat quitter!
PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 6:05 pm 
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And the first one to be accused of assisting a military junta in kidnapping?

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 Post subject: Re: Pope Benedict is a big, fat quitter!
PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 6:57 am 
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i think the examples i can think of are all local/individualized groups of catholics moving towards some social justice agenda, i would say without the support of mother church. the examples i can think of off the top of my head are local but i wouldn't be surprised if they were repeated throughout latin america: the local liberation theology movements here in Brazil pre-dictatorship [which the papacy did not support, and only grudgingly did so; later the church yielded to military pressure to back off], individual or smaller groups of catholic nuns/monks doing direct social work such as Dorothy Stang (more recently).

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 Post subject: Re: Pope Benedict is a big, fat quitter!
PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 11:09 am 
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jogirl wrote:
Well, they've just elected the new one:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-21777494
The first Latin American and the first Jesuit to be pope, apparently.
But not the first to be anything but a reactionary homophobe, alas. Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose. http://gawker.com/5990449/new-pope-humble-hardliner-called-fight-against-gay-rights-a-war-of-god

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 Post subject: Re: Pope Benedict is a big, fat quitter!
PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 12:27 pm 
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this is probably a really dumb question but im gonna ask it anyways.
i know the Pope is the head of the Catholic church but does he figure anywhere else into Christianity?

like if you're Protestant or Baptist or whatever do you give a rat's asparagus about the Pope?
if not who is the Pope-like person for those sects?

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 Post subject: Re: Pope Benedict is a big, fat quitter!
PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 12:39 pm 
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A big chunk of the whole point of being Protestant is not having a pope. The pope does figure into Eastern Orthodox variations of Christianity (Russian Orthodox, Greek Orthodox, etc.) which are "in communion" with the Catholic Church. They also have their own head of church. For Protestant groups, some have a church head, some don't - it depends how hierarchical the church is and on their understanding of religious authority. Few protestant groups care much about the pope (the Anglicans/Episcopalians seem to be very interested in the pope and they have some kind of easy way in if their priests want to become Catholic priests, for example, I am sure the Baptists could not care less). You don't hear much about the heads of other Christian denominations because they're all much smaller than the Catholic Church and very few of those leaders have the kind of international authority the pope has.

here are some more crazy details: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pope#Objec ... the_papacy


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 Post subject: Re: Pope Benedict is a big, fat quitter!
PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 1:04 pm 
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i was kind of thinking that (that the big thing about the Protestant church is no Pope) but i couldnt remember.
thanks!

i also know several people who definitely consider themselves Catholic and think the Pope is silly/stupid. i believe all of these people also happen to be women who think women should be allowed into the priesthood so i guess i see where they are getting that opinion from!

i have very little knowledge of religion but i find it interesting when it comes up like this!

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 Post subject: Re: Pope Benedict is a big, fat quitter!
PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 1:10 pm 
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When I had a partner who was a practicing Catholic I used to go to mass with her sometimes at a church that did events around immigration reform and stuff, and even hosted her to give a talk about gay issues, including same-sex marriage I think. It was an open and affirming church, though.

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 Post subject: Re: Pope Benedict is a big, fat quitter!
PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 1:18 pm 
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eight wrote:
I can't think of a single period in time where the C C worked towards social justice. I am not being contrarian (and anti-theist here), I am drawing a blank.
And do NOT mention Mother Teresa.


I'm curious about this, too. I can't think of a single thing that would fit the criteria of "social justice". I'd like to be enlightened, but for now, I'll remain staunchly anti-Catholic.

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 Post subject: Re: Pope Benedict is a big, fat quitter!
PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 1:21 pm 
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I am curious as to why you don't want to hear about Mother Teresa. Because you don't consider her ministry social justice but something else? I definitely think part of her mission (not encouraging contraception under the dictates of the Catholic Church for example) were problematic.

I posted earlier in the thread about the CC's efforts in Poland and in Central and Latin Am, which I do think were definitely social justice.

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 Post subject: Re: Pope Benedict is a big, fat quitter!
PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 1:22 pm 
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LisaPunk wrote:
like if you're Protestant or Baptist or whatever do you give a rat's asparagus about the Pope?
if not who is the Pope-like person for those sects?


no, but you may give a Ratzinger. hiyo!

There is no pope-like person for other sects, because other sects exist as groups that tried to get away from the capital R Ritual of Catholicism.

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 Post subject: Re: Pope Benedict is a big, fat quitter!
PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 1:28 pm 
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I know he was a grumbly old contrarian, but Christopher Hitchens had some uncharitable things to say about Mother Teresa.

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 Post subject: Re: Pope Benedict is a big, fat quitter!
PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 1:30 pm 
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Pope Humble Joe I.

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 Post subject: Re: Pope Benedict is a big, fat quitter!
PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 1:51 pm 
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FootFace wrote:
I know he was a grumbly old contrarian, but Christopher Hitchens had some uncharitable things to say about Mother Teresa.


Grumpy old contrarian who I loved. Thank god for Hitchens.

(I'm getting a lot of use out of font styles today!)

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 Post subject: Re: Pope Benedict is a big, fat quitter!
PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 1:53 pm 
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I hope he starts every homily with "Well, now, I'm just a simple rail worker's son, I wouldn't know about that."

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 Post subject: Re: Pope Benedict is a big, fat quitter!
PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 1:55 pm 
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paprikapapaya wrote:
no, but you may give a Ratzinger. hiyo!

There is no pope-like person for other sects, because other sects exist as groups that tried to get away from the capital R Ritual of Catholicism.

high 5!

as a quaker i do feel entitled to throw around the term Papist a lot. I tend not to (as i live in a sort of papist country), but it is nice every once in a while. you know, surrounded as we are these days by this flutter of papist tomfoolery.


also,
Quote:
I hope he starts every homily with "Well, now, I'm just a simple rail worker's son, I wouldn't know about that."

indeedy. or as we keep hearing on every newscast, "i used to be a cleaning person in a sock factory before i became a chemical engineer, so why would my opinion about gay unions matter?"

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 Post subject: Re: Pope Benedict is a big, fat quitter!
PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 5:08 pm 
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He puts his vestments on one fanon at a time, just like us.

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 Post subject: Re: Pope Benedict is a big, fat quitter!
PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 5:47 pm 
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paprikapapaya wrote:
FootFace wrote:
I know he was a grumbly old contrarian, but Christopher Hitchens had some uncharitable things to say about Mother Teresa.


Grumpy old contrarian who I loved. Thank god for Hitchens.


Yes indeedy.

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 Post subject: Re: Pope Benedict is a big, fat quitter!
PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 7:01 pm 
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LisaPunk wrote:
i know the Pope is the head of the Catholic church but does he figure anywhere else into Christianity?

like if you're Protestant or Baptist or whatever do you give a rat's asparagus about the Pope?

Oh my goodness. Ask all that to the bowler hat wearing, tin-whistle playing feckers that march through my city on a regular basis in the summer. And ask fezza and stranger what the all difference is...

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 Post subject: Re: Pope Benedict is a big, fat quitter!
PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 9:02 pm 
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eight wrote:
I can't think of a single period in time where the C C worked towards social justice. I am not being contrarian (and anti-theist here), I am drawing a blank.
And do NOT mention Mother Teresa.

This doesn't satisfy the criteria of the Church itself working toward social justice, but the Catholic Worker Movement is very justice minded.

wikipedia wrote:
The radical philosophy of the group can be described as Christian anarchism.


Too bad the church isn't more like them--one of the few pacifist groups during WWII.

Also, Daniel Berrigan, a priest, was an antiwar activist and heavily involved in the civil rights movement.

Anyway, I'm more of an anarchist (and anti-theist), so I have barely a passing interest in the pope thing.


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 Post subject: Re: Pope Benedict is a big, fat quitter!
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 3:25 am 
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interrobang?! wrote:
LisaPunk wrote:
i know the Pope is the head of the Catholic church but does he figure anywhere else into Christianity?

like if you're Protestant or Baptist or whatever do you give a rat's asparagus about the Pope?

Oh my goodness. Ask all that to the bowler hat wearing, tin-whistle playing feckers that march through my city on a regular basis in the summer. And ask fezza and stranger what the all difference is...


...it's true. which isn't to say the whole irish thing is strictly about religion. quite the opposite. but you don't get very many elected officials anywhere else in the world insisting, publicly, that the pope is the antichrist. it's our wee ulster's idea of reasoned debate.


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 Post subject: Re: Pope Benedict is a big, fat quitter!
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 3:28 am 
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mumbles wrote:
He puts his vestments on one fanon at a time, just like us.


ha! i have been educated. the only fanon i was aware of was frantz. image that papacy.


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 Post subject: Re: Pope Benedict is a big, fat quitter!
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 5:37 am 
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stranger wrote:
mumbles wrote:
He puts his vestments on one fanon at a time, just like us.


ha! i have been educated. the only fanon i was aware of was frantz. image that papacy.

Ha!

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 Post subject: Re: Pope Benedict is a big, fat quitter!
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 6:56 am 
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Mother Teresa was extremely anti-woman, her medical care was sub-par, she thought suffering would bring people closer to Jesus (so suffering is good?) etc.

Whenever you hear positive things about Catholics, it is about single people (who most of the time get in trouble with Mother Church) or groups, never "The Catholic Church".
I, personally, think that the C C has been one of the strongest forces to keep peoples' lives shitty and in the dark ages. It is anti everything that makes this world a better, and more diverse place.


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 Post subject: Re: Pope Benedict is a big, fat quitter!
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 7:23 am 
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eight wrote:
Whenever you hear positive things about Catholics, it is about single people (who most of the time get in trouble with Mother Church) or groups, never "The Catholic Church".
I, personally, think that the C C has been one of the strongest forces to keep peoples' lives shitty and in the dark ages.


So true. Also when people try change something, they are usually shut down pretty quickly.


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